WTC Towers: The Case For Controlled Demolition

[s***@gmail.com]

WTC Towers: The Case For Controlled Demolition
By Herman Schoenfeld

In this article we show that "top-down" controlled demolition
accurately accounts for the collapse times of the World Trade Center
towers. A top-down controlled demolition can be simply characterized
as a "pancake collapse" of a building missing its support columns.
This demolition profile requires that the support columns holding a
floor be destroyed just before that floor is collided with by the
upper falling masses. The net effect is a pancake-style collapse at
near free fall speed.

This model predicts a WTC 1 collapse time of 11.38 seconds, and a WTC
2 collapse time of 9.48 seconds. Those times accurately match the
seismographic data of those events.1 Refer to equations (1.9) and
(1.10) for details.

It should be noted that this model differs massively from a "natural
pancake collapse" in that the geometrical composition of the structure
is not considered (as it is physically destroyed). A natural pancake
collapse features a diminishing velocity rapidly approaching rest due
to the resistance offered by the columns and surrounding "steel mesh".

DEMOLITION MODEL

A top-down controlled demolition of a building is considered as
follows

1. An initial block of j floors commences to free fall.

2. The floor below the collapsing block has its support structures
disabled just prior the collision with the block.

3. The collapsing block merges with the momentarily levitating floor,
increases in mass, decreases in velocity (but preserves momentum), and
continues to free fall.

4. If not at ground floor, goto step 2.


Let j be the number of floors in the initial set of collapsing floors.
Let N be the number of remaining floors to collapse.
Let h be the average floor height.
Let g be the gravitational field strength at ground-level.
Let T be the total collapse time.

Using the elementary motion equation

distance = (initial velocity) * time + 1/2 * acceleration * time^2

We solve for the time taken by the k'th floor to free fall the height
of one floor

[1.1] t_k=(-u_k+(u_k^2+2gh))/g

where u_k is the initial velocity of the k'th collapsing floor.

The total collapse time is the sum of the N individual free fall times

[1.2] T = sum(k=0)^N (-u_k+(u_k^2+2gh))/g

Now the mass of the k'th floor at the point of collapse is the mass of
itself (m) plus the mass of all the floors collapsed before it (k-1)m
plus the mass on the initial collapsing block jm.

[1.3] m_k=m+(k-1)m+jm =(j+k)m

If we let u_k denote the initial velocity of the k'th collapsing
floor, the final velocity reached by that floor prior to collision
with its below floor is

[1.4] v_k=SQRT(u_k^2+2gh)


which follows from the elementary equation of motion

(final velocity)^2 = (initial velocity)^2 + 2 * (acceleration) *
(distance)

Conservation of momentum demands that the initial momentum of the k'th
floor equal the final momemtum of the (k-1)'th floor.

[1.5] m_k u_k = m_(k-1) v_(k-1)


Substituting (1.3) and (1.4) into (1.5)
[1.6] (j + k)m u_k= (j + k - 1)m SQRT(u_(k-1)^2+ 2gh)


Solving for the initial velocity u_k

[1.7] u_k=(j + k - 1)/(j + k) SQRT(u_(k-1)^2+2gh)


Which is a recurrence equation with base value

[1.8] u_0=0



The WTC towers were 417 meters tall and had 110 floors. Tower 1 began
collapsing on the 93rd floor. Making substitutions N=93, j=17 , g=9.8
into (1.2) and (1.7) gives


[1.9] WTC 1 Collapse Time = sum(k=0)^93 (-u_k+(u_k^2+74.28))/9.8 =
11.38 sec
where
u_k=(16+ k)/(17+ k ) SQRT(u_(k-1)^2+74.28) ;/ u_0=0



Tower 2 began collapsing on the 77th floor. Making substitutions N=77,
j=33 , g=9.8 into (1.2) and (1.7) gives


[1.10] WTC 2 Collapse Time =sum(k=0)^77 (-u_k+(u_k^2+74.28))/9.8 =
9.48 sec
Where
u_k=(32+k)/(33+k) SQRT(u_(k-1)^2+74.28) ;/ u_0=0


REFERENCES

"Seismic Waves Generated By Aircraft Impacts and Building Collapses at
World Trade Center ", http://www.ldeo.columbia.edu/LCSN/Eq/20010911_WTC/WTC_LDEO_KIM.pdf

APPENDIX A: HASKELL SIMULATION PROGRAM

This function returns the gravitational field strength in SI units.

g :: Double
g = 9.8

This function calculates the total time for a top-down demolition.
Parameters:
_H - the total height of building
_N - the number of floors in building
_J - the floor number which initiated the top-down cascade (the 0'th
floor being the ground floor)

cascadeTime :: Double -> Double -> Double -> Double
cascadeTime _H _N _J = sum [ (- (u k) + sqrt( (u k)^2 + 2*g*h))/g | k<-[0..n]]
where
j = _N - _J
n = _N - j
h = _H/_N
u 0 = 0
u k = (j + k - 1)/(j + k) * sqrt( (u (k-1))^2 + 2*g*h )

Simulates a top-down demolition of WTC 1 in SI units.

wtc1 :: Double
wtc1 = cascadeTime 417 110 93

Simulates a top-down demolition of WTC 2 in SI units.

wtc2 :: Double
wtc2 = cascadeTime 417 110 77

[MPG]

imas fino video a sad tu neke formule.

[f***@gmail.com]

Post by s***@gmail.com
WTC Towers: The Case For Controlled Demolition
By Herman Schoenfeld
In this article we show that "top-down" controlled demolition
accurately accounts for the collapse times of the World Trade Center
towers. A top-down controlled demolition can be simply characterized
as a "pancake collapse" of a building missing its support columns.
This demolition profile requires that the support columns holding a
floor be destroyed just before that floor is collided with by the
upper falling masses. The net effect is a pancake-style collapse at
near free fall speed.
This model predicts a WTC 1 collapse time of 11.38 seconds, and a WTC
2 collapse time of 9.48 seconds. Those times accurately match the
seismographic data of those events.1 Refer to equations (1.9) and
(1.10) for details.
It should be noted that this model differs massively from a "natural
pancake collapse" in that the geometrical composition of the structure
is not considered (as it is physically destroyed). A natural pancake
collapse features a diminishing velocity rapidly approaching rest due
to the resistance offered by the columns and surrounding "steel mesh".
DEMOLITION MODEL
A top-down controlled demolition of a building is considered as
follows
1. An initial block of j floors commences to free fall.
2. The floor below the collapsing block has its support structures
disabled just prior the collision with the block.
3. The collapsing block merges with the momentarily levitating floor,
increases in mass, decreases in velocity (but preserves momentum), and
continues to free fall.
4. If not at ground floor, goto step 2.
Let j be the number of floors in the initial set of collapsing floors.
Let N be the number of remaining floors to collapse.
Let h be the average floor height.
Let g be the gravitational field strength at ground-level.
Let T be the total collapse time.
Using the elementary motion equation
distance = (initial velocity) * time + 1/2 * acceleration * time^2
We solve for the time taken by the k'th floor to free fall the height
of one floor
[1.1] t_k=(-u_k+(u_k^2+2gh))/g
where u_k is the initial velocity of the k'th collapsing floor.
The total collapse time is the sum of the N individual free fall times
[1.2] T = sum(k=0)^N (-u_k+(u_k^2+2gh))/g
Now the mass of the k'th floor at the point of collapse is the mass of
itself (m) plus the mass of all the floors collapsed before it (k-1)m
plus the mass on the initial collapsing block jm.
[1.3] m_k=m+(k-1)m+jm =(j+k)m
If we let u_k denote the initial velocity of the k'th collapsing
floor, the final velocity reached by that floor prior to collision
with its below floor is
[1.4] v_k=SQRT(u_k^2+2gh)
which follows from the elementary equation of motion
(final velocity)^2 = (initial velocity)^2 + 2 * (acceleration) *
(distance)
Conservation of momentum demands that the initial momentum of the k'th
floor equal the final momemtum of the (k-1)'th floor.
[1.5] m_k u_k = m_(k-1) v_(k-1)
Substituting (1.3) and (1.4) into (1.5)
[1.6] (j + k)m u_k= (j + k - 1)m SQRT(u_(k-1)^2+ 2gh)
Solving for the initial velocity u_k
[1.7] u_k=(j + k - 1)/(j + k) SQRT(u_(k-1)^2+2gh)
Which is a recurrence equation with base value
[1.8] u_0=0
The WTC towers were 417 meters tall and had 110 floors. Tower 1 began
collapsing on the 93rd floor. Making substitutions N=93, j=17 , g=9.8
into (1.2) and (1.7) gives
[1.9] WTC 1 Collapse Time = sum(k=0)^93 (-u_k+(u_k^2+74.28))/9.8 =
11.38 sec
where
u_k=(16+ k)/(17+ k ) SQRT(u_(k-1)^2+74.28) ;/ u_0=0
Tower 2 began collapsing on the 77th floor. Making substitutions N=77,
j=33 , g=9.8 into (1.2) and (1.7) gives
[1.10] WTC 2 Collapse Time =sum(k=0)^77 (-u_k+(u_k^2+74.28))/9.8 =
9.48 sec
Where
u_k=(32+k)/(33+k) SQRT(u_(k-1)^2+74.28) ;/ u_0=0
REFERENCES
"Seismic Waves Generated By Aircraft Impacts and Building Collapses at
World Trade Center ",http://www.ldeo.columbia.edu/LCSN/Eq/20010911_WTC/WTC_LDEO_KIM.pdf
APPENDIX A: HASKELL SIMULATION PROGRAM
This function returns the gravitational field strength in SI units.

g :: Double
g = 9.8

This function calculates the total time for a top-down demolition.
_H - the total height of building
_N - the number of floors in building
_J - the floor number which initiated the top-down cascade (the 0'th
floor being the ground floor)

cascadeTime :: Double -> Double -> Double -> Double
cascadeTime _H _N _J = sum [ (- (u k) + sqrt( (u k)^2 + 2*g*h))/g | k<-[0..n]]
where
j = _N - _J
n = _N - j
h = _H/_N
u 0 = 0
u k = (j + k - 1)/(j + k) * sqrt( (u (k-1))^2 + 2*g*h )

Simulates a top-down demolition of WTC 1 in SI units.

wtc1 :: Double
wtc1 = cascadeTime 417 110 93

Simulates a top-down demolition of WTC 2 in SI units.

wtc2 :: Double
wtc2 = cascadeTime 417 110 77

Why confuse us with facts...the Zionazi want us to think Arabs did it.
It is much easier to hate them, since we don not know jack shit about
Muslims.

[John C. Randolph]

Post by f***@gmail.com
Why confuse us with facts...the Zionazi want us to think Arabs did it.

Probably because the attackers were Arabs, you tragically confused moron.

-jcr

[Me]

Post by f***@gmail.com

Post by s***@gmail.com
WTC Towers: The Case For Controlled Demolition
By Herman Schoenfeld
In this article we show that "top-down" controlled demolition
accurately accounts for the collapse times of the World Trade Center
towers. A top-down controlled demolition can be simply characterized
as a "pancake collapse" of a building missing its support columns.
This demolition profile requires that the support columns holding a
floor be destroyed just before that floor is collided with by the
upper falling masses. The net effect is a pancake-style collapse at
near free fall speed.
This model predicts a WTC 1 collapse time of 11.38 seconds, and a WTC
2 collapse time of 9.48 seconds. Those times accurately match the
seismographic data of those events.1 Refer to equations (1.9)  and
(1.10)  for details.
It should be noted that this model differs massively from a "natural
pancake collapse" in that the geometrical composition of the structure
is not considered (as it is physically destroyed).  A natural pancake
collapse features a diminishing velocity rapidly approaching rest due
to the resistance offered by the columns and surrounding "steel mesh".
DEMOLITION MODEL
A top-down controlled demolition of a building is considered as
follows
        1. An initial block of j floors commences to free fall.
        2. The floor below the collapsing block has its support structures
disabled just prior the collision with the block.
        3. The collapsing block merges with the momentarily levitating floor,
increases in mass, decreases in velocity (but preserves momentum), and
continues to free fall.
        4. If not at ground floor, goto step 2.
Let j be the number of floors in the initial set of collapsing floors.
Let N be the number of remaining floors to collapse.
Let h be the average floor height.
Let g be the gravitational field strength at ground-level.
Let T be the total collapse time.
Using the elementary motion equation
    distance = (initial velocity) * time + 1/2 * acceleration * time^2
We solve for the time taken by the k'th floor to free fall the height
of one floor
        [1.1]   t_k=(-u_k+(u_k^2+2gh))/g
where u_k is the initial velocity of the k'th collapsing floor.
The total collapse time is the sum of the N individual free fall times
        [1.2]   T = sum(k=0)^N (-u_k+(u_k^2+2gh))/g
Now the mass of the k'th floor at the point of collapse is the mass of
itself (m) plus the mass of all the floors collapsed before it (k-1)m
plus the mass on the initial collapsing block jm.
        [1.3]   m_k=m+(k-1)m+jm =(j+k)m
If we let u_k denote the initial velocity of the k'th collapsing
floor, the final velocity reached by that floor prior to collision
with its below floor is
        [1.4]   v_k=SQRT(u_k^2+2gh)
which follows from the elementary equation of motion
(final velocity)^2 = (initial velocity)^2 + 2 * (acceleration) *
(distance)
Conservation of momentum demands that the initial momentum of the k'th
floor equal the final momemtum of the (k-1)'th floor.
        [1.5]   m_k  u_k  = m_(k-1)  v_(k-1)
Substituting (1.3) and (1.4) into (1.5)
        [1.6]   (j + k)m u_k= (j + k - 1)m SQRT(u_(k-1)^2+ 2gh)
Solving for the initial velocity u_k
        [1.7]   u_k=(j + k - 1)/(j + k) SQRT(u_(k-1)^2+2gh)
Which is a recurrence equation with base value
        [1.8]   u_0=0
The WTC towers were 417 meters tall and had 110 floors. Tower 1 began
collapsing on the 93rd floor.  Making substitutions N=93, j=17 , g=9.8
into (1.2) and (1.7) gives
        [1.9]   WTC 1 Collapse Time = sum(k=0)^93 (-u_k+(u_k^2+74.28))/9.8 =
11.38 sec
                where
                        u_k=(16+ k)/(17+ k ) SQRT(u_(k-1)^2+74.28)      ;/ u_0=0
Tower 2 began collapsing on the 77th floor. Making substitutions N=77,
j=33 , g=9.8 into (1.2) and (1.7) gives
        [1.10]  WTC 2 Collapse Time =sum(k=0)^77 (-u_k+(u_k^2+74.28))/9.8 =
9.48 sec
                Where
                        u_k=(32+k)/(33+k) SQRT(u_(k-1)^2+74.28)      ;/ u_0=0
REFERENCES
"Seismic Waves Generated By Aircraft Impacts and Building Collapses at
World Trade Center ",http://www.ldeo.columbia.edu/LCSN/Eq/20010911_WTC/WTC_LDEO_KIM.pdf
APPENDIX A: HASKELL SIMULATION PROGRAM
This function returns the gravitational field strength in SI units.

g :: Double
g = 9.8

This function calculates the total time for a top-down demolition.
  _H - the total height of building
  _N - the number of floors in building
  _J - the floor number which initiated the top-down cascade (the 0'th
floor being the ground floor)

cascadeTime :: Double -> Double -> Double -> Double
cascadeTime _H _N _J  =  sum [ (- (u k) + sqrt( (u k)^2 + 2*g*h))/g | k<-[0..n]]
                      where
                        j = _N - _J
                        n = _N - j
                        h = _H/_N
                        u 0 = 0
                        u k = (j + k - 1)/(j + k) * sqrt( (u (k-1))^2 + 2*g*h )

Simulates a top-down demolition of WTC 1 in SI units.

wtc1 :: Double
wtc1 = cascadeTime 417 110 93

Simulates a top-down demolition of WTC 2 in SI units.

wtc2 :: Double
wtc2 = cascadeTime 417 110 77

Why confuse us with facts...the Zionazi want us to think Arabs did it.
It is much easier to hate them, since we don not know jack shit about
Muslims.- Hide quoted text -
- Show quoted text -

It's a fact that arab muslim terrorists did it you fuck face.

[Midex]

Post by Me

Post by f***@gmail.com

Post by s***@gmail.com
WTC Towers: The Case For Controlled Demolition
By Herman Schoenfeld
In this article we show that "top-down" controlled demolition
accurately accounts for the collapse times of the World Trade Center
towers. A top-down controlled demolition can be simply characterized
as a "pancake collapse" of a building missing its support columns.
This demolition profile requires that the support columns holding a
floor be destroyed just before that floor is collided with by the
upper falling masses. The net effect is a pancake-style collapse at
near free fall speed.
This model predicts a WTC 1 collapse time of 11.38 seconds, and a WTC
2 collapse time of 9.48 seconds. Those times accurately match the
seismographic data of those events.1 Refer to equations (1.9) and
(1.10) for details.
It should be noted that this model differs massively from a "natural
pancake collapse" in that the geometrical composition of the structure
is not considered (as it is physically destroyed). A natural pancake
collapse features a diminishing velocity rapidly approaching rest due
to the resistance offered by the columns and surrounding "steel mesh".
DEMOLITION MODEL
A top-down controlled demolition of a building is considered as
follows
1. An initial block of j floors commences to free fall.
2. The floor below the collapsing block has its support structures
disabled just prior the collision with the block.
3. The collapsing block merges with the momentarily levitating floor,
increases in mass, decreases in velocity (but preserves momentum), and
continues to free fall.
4. If not at ground floor, goto step 2.
Let j be the number of floors in the initial set of collapsing floors.
Let N be the number of remaining floors to collapse.
Let h be the average floor height.
Let g be the gravitational field strength at ground-level.
Let T be the total collapse time.
Using the elementary motion equation
distance = (initial velocity) * time + 1/2 * acceleration * time^2
We solve for the time taken by the k'th floor to free fall the height
of one floor
[1.1] t_k=(-u_k+(u_k^2+2gh))/g
where u_k is the initial velocity of the k'th collapsing floor.
The total collapse time is the sum of the N individual free fall times
[1.2] T = sum(k=0)^N (-u_k+(u_k^2+2gh))/g
Now the mass of the k'th floor at the point of collapse is the mass of
itself (m) plus the mass of all the floors collapsed before it (k-1)m
plus the mass on the initial collapsing block jm.
[1.3] m_k=m+(k-1)m+jm =(j+k)m
If we let u_k denote the initial velocity of the k'th collapsing
floor, the final velocity reached by that floor prior to collision
with its below floor is
[1.4] v_k=SQRT(u_k^2+2gh)
which follows from the elementary equation of motion
(final velocity)^2 = (initial velocity)^2 + 2 * (acceleration) *
(distance)
Conservation of momentum demands that the initial momentum of the k'th
floor equal the final momemtum of the (k-1)'th floor.
[1.5] m_k u_k = m_(k-1) v_(k-1)
Substituting (1.3) and (1.4) into (1.5)
[1.6] (j + k)m u_k= (j + k - 1)m SQRT(u_(k-1)^2+ 2gh)
Solving for the initial velocity u_k
[1.7] u_k=(j + k - 1)/(j + k) SQRT(u_(k-1)^2+2gh)
Which is a recurrence equation with base value
[1.8] u_0=0
The WTC towers were 417 meters tall and had 110 floors. Tower 1 began
collapsing on the 93rd floor. Making substitutions N=93, j=17 , g=9.8
into (1.2) and (1.7) gives
[1.9] WTC 1 Collapse Time = sum(k=0)^93 (-u_k+(u_k^2+74.28))/9.8 =
11.38 sec
where
u_k=(16+ k)/(17+ k ) SQRT(u_(k-1)^2+74.28) ;/ u_0=0
Tower 2 began collapsing on the 77th floor. Making substitutions N=77,
j=33 , g=9.8 into (1.2) and (1.7) gives
[1.10] WTC 2 Collapse Time =sum(k=0)^77 (-u_k+(u_k^2+74.28))/9.8 =
9.48 sec
Where
u_k=(32+k)/(33+k) SQRT(u_(k-1)^2+74.28) ;/ u_0=0
REFERENCES
"Seismic Waves Generated By Aircraft Impacts and Building Collapses at
World Trade Center ",http://www.ldeo.columbia.edu/LCSN/Eq/20010911_WTC/WTC_LDEO_KIM.pdf
APPENDIX A: HASKELL SIMULATION PROGRAM
This function returns the gravitational field strength in SI units.

g :: Double
g = 9.8

This function calculates the total time for a top-down demolition.
_H - the total height of building
_N - the number of floors in building
_J - the floor number which initiated the top-down cascade (the 0'th
floor being the ground floor)

cascadeTime :: Double -> Double -> Double -> Double
cascadeTime _H _N _J = sum [ (- (u k) + sqrt( (u k)^2 + 2*g*h))/g | k<-[0..n]]
where
j = _N - _J
n = _N - j
h = _H/_N
u 0 = 0
u k = (j + k - 1)/(j + k) * sqrt( (u (k-1))^2 + 2*g*h )

Simulates a top-down demolition of WTC 1 in SI units.

wtc1 :: Double
wtc1 = cascadeTime 417 110 93

Simulates a top-down demolition of WTC 2 in SI units.

wtc2 :: Double
wtc2 = cascadeTime 417 110 77

Why confuse us with facts...the Zionazi want us to think Arabs did it.
It is much easier to hate them, since we don not know jack shit about
Muslims.- Hide quoted text -
- Show quoted text -

It's a fact that arab muslim terrorists did it you fuck face.

lol "Its a fact" - its amazing that all these mental retards even know
how to type.
Here are the "facts" fuckwit:
www.ae911truth.org

[Midex]

Post by f***@gmail.com

Post by s***@gmail.com
WTC Towers: The Case For Controlled Demolition
By Herman Schoenfeld
In this article we show that "top-down" controlled demolition
accurately accounts for the collapse times of the World Trade Center
towers. A top-down controlled demolition can be simply characterized
as a "pancake collapse" of a building missing its support columns.
This demolition profile requires that the support columns holding a
floor be destroyed just before that floor is collided with by the
upper falling masses. The net effect is a pancake-style collapse at
near free fall speed.
This model predicts a WTC 1 collapse time of 11.38 seconds, and a WTC
2 collapse time of 9.48 seconds. Those times accurately match the
seismographic data of those events.1 Refer to equations (1.9) and
(1.10) for details.
It should be noted that this model differs massively from a "natural
pancake collapse" in that the geometrical composition of the structure
is not considered (as it is physically destroyed). A natural pancake
collapse features a diminishing velocity rapidly approaching rest due
to the resistance offered by the columns and surrounding "steel mesh".
DEMOLITION MODEL
A top-down controlled demolition of a building is considered as
follows
1. An initial block of j floors commences to free fall.
2. The floor below the collapsing block has its support structures
disabled just prior the collision with the block.
3. The collapsing block merges with the momentarily levitating floor,
increases in mass, decreases in velocity (but preserves momentum), and
continues to free fall.
4. If not at ground floor, goto step 2.
Let j be the number of floors in the initial set of collapsing floors.
Let N be the number of remaining floors to collapse.
Let h be the average floor height.
Let g be the gravitational field strength at ground-level.
Let T be the total collapse time.
Using the elementary motion equation
distance = (initial velocity) * time + 1/2 * acceleration * time^2
We solve for the time taken by the k'th floor to free fall the height
of one floor
[1.1] t_k=(-u_k+(u_k^2+2gh))/g
where u_k is the initial velocity of the k'th collapsing floor.
The total collapse time is the sum of the N individual free fall times
[1.2] T = sum(k=0)^N (-u_k+(u_k^2+2gh))/g
Now the mass of the k'th floor at the point of collapse is the mass of
itself (m) plus the mass of all the floors collapsed before it (k-1)m
plus the mass on the initial collapsing block jm.
[1.3] m_k=m+(k-1)m+jm =(j+k)m
If we let u_k denote the initial velocity of the k'th collapsing
floor, the final velocity reached by that floor prior to collision
with its below floor is
[1.4] v_k=SQRT(u_k^2+2gh)
which follows from the elementary equation of motion
(final velocity)^2 = (initial velocity)^2 + 2 * (acceleration) *
(distance)
Conservation of momentum demands that the initial momentum of the k'th
floor equal the final momemtum of the (k-1)'th floor.
[1.5] m_k u_k = m_(k-1) v_(k-1)
Substituting (1.3) and (1.4) into (1.5)
[1.6] (j + k)m u_k= (j + k - 1)m SQRT(u_(k-1)^2+ 2gh)
Solving for the initial velocity u_k
[1.7] u_k=(j + k - 1)/(j + k) SQRT(u_(k-1)^2+2gh)
Which is a recurrence equation with base value
[1.8] u_0=0
The WTC towers were 417 meters tall and had 110 floors. Tower 1 began
collapsing on the 93rd floor. Making substitutions N=93, j=17 , g=9.8
into (1.2) and (1.7) gives
[1.9] WTC 1 Collapse Time = sum(k=0)^93 (-u_k+(u_k^2+74.28))/9.8 =
11.38 sec
where
u_k=(16+ k)/(17+ k ) SQRT(u_(k-1)^2+74.28) ;/ u_0=0
Tower 2 began collapsing on the 77th floor. Making substitutions N=77,
j=33 , g=9.8 into (1.2) and (1.7) gives
[1.10] WTC 2 Collapse Time =sum(k=0)^77 (-u_k+(u_k^2+74.28))/9.8 =
9.48 sec
Where
u_k=(32+k)/(33+k) SQRT(u_(k-1)^2+74.28) ;/ u_0=0
REFERENCES
"Seismic Waves Generated By Aircraft Impacts and Building Collapses at
World Trade Center ",http://www.ldeo.columbia.edu/LCSN/Eq/20010911_WTC/WTC_LDEO_KIM.pdf
APPENDIX A: HASKELL SIMULATION PROGRAM
This function returns the gravitational field strength in SI units.

g :: Double
g = 9.8

This function calculates the total time for a top-down demolition.
_H - the total height of building
_N - the number of floors in building
_J - the floor number which initiated the top-down cascade (the 0'th
floor being the ground floor)

cascadeTime :: Double -> Double -> Double -> Double
cascadeTime _H _N _J = sum [ (- (u k) + sqrt( (u k)^2 + 2*g*h))/g | k<-[0..n]]
where
j = _N - _J
n = _N - j
h = _H/_N
u 0 = 0
u k = (j + k - 1)/(j + k) * sqrt( (u (k-1))^2 + 2*g*h )

Simulates a top-down demolition of WTC 1 in SI units.

wtc1 :: Double
wtc1 = cascadeTime 417 110 93

Simulates a top-down demolition of WTC 2 in SI units.

wtc2 :: Double
wtc2 = cascadeTime 417 110 77

Why confuse us with facts...the Zionazi want us to think Arabs did it.
It is much easier to hate them, since we don not know jack shit about
Muslims.

We don't know jack shit about jews either.
Learn about THE JEWS and then you will know the enemy:
www.iamthewitness.com

[John C. Randolph]

Post by s***@gmail.com
In this article we show that "top-down" controlled demolition
accurately accounts for the collapse times of the World Trade Center
towers.

So what? A collapsing building falls at 9.8 meters/second^2, whatever
causes it to collapse.

The towers collapsed because the fire weakened the steel framing,
causing the top floors to buckle. Once the collapse started, it
overwhelmed the support structure below it.

-jcr

[f***@gmail.com]

Post by s***@gmail.com
In this article we show that "top-down" controlled demolition
accurately accounts for the collapse times of the World Trade Center
towers.

So what?  A collapsing building falls at 9.8 meters/second^2, whatever
causes it to collapse.
The towers collapsed because the fire weakened the steel framing,
causing the top floors to buckle.  Once the collapse started, it
overwhelmed the support structure below it.
-jcr

What I find interesting in the forensic engineering sense is that the
tower that was hit last fell first.

Aside from the different angles of entry, which could affect the time
to failure, the tower hit 2nd was also hit much lower, meaning there
was about twice the stresses on it.

Count me a tinfoil-hat wearer, but I think it's not impossible that
(some of) these Truther apparent idiots are false-flag black
propaganda intended to poison the well of 9/11 conspiracy theories in
general.

Not that I think elements of the present administration "knew" about
9/11 per se, but it wouldn't surprise me if key decision makers took a
calculated risk to allow the hijackers to do their hijack and produce
a little 80s-style hijack drama at some airport somewhere. . . that
would have been good for business.

[Al Dykes]

Post by f***@gmail.com

Post by s***@gmail.com
In this article we show that "top-down" controlled demolition
accurately accounts for the collapse times of the World Trade Center
towers.

So what? =A0A collapsing building falls at 9.8 meters/second^2, whatever
causes it to collapse.
The towers collapsed because the fire weakened the steel framing,
causing the top floors to buckle. =A0Once the collapse started, it
overwhelmed the support structure below it.
-jcr

What I find interesting in the forensic engineering sense is that the
tower that was hit last fell first.
Aside from the different angles of entry, which could affect the time
to failure, the tower hit 2nd was also hit much lower, meaning there
was about twice the stresses on it.

The second tower was hit much lower and so had much more weight above
the floors that were weakened by fire and impact damage.

[Midex]

Post by Al Dykes

Post by f***@gmail.com

Post by s***@gmail.com
In this article we show that "top-down" controlled demolition
accurately accounts for the collapse times of the World Trade Center
towers.

So what? =A0A collapsing building falls at 9.8 meters/second^2, whatever
causes it to collapse.
The towers collapsed because the fire weakened the steel framing,
causing the top floors to buckle. =A0Once the collapse started, it
overwhelmed the support structure below it.
-jcr

What I find interesting in the forensic engineering sense is that the
tower that was hit last fell first.
Aside from the different angles of entry, which could affect the time
to failure, the tower hit 2nd was also hit much lower, meaning there
was about twice the stresses on it.

The second tower was hit much lower and so had much more weight above
the floors that were weakened by fire and impact damage.

Thats correct Al Dykes. And then the unsupported floors above decided
to fall directly down into the greatest resistance rather than toppled
over the edge.

Tell me, when you let go of a standing bicycle, does it collapse into
itself? Hey fuckwit moron? Or does it fall over side-ways?

Go and try it with a bicycle fuckwit moron.

Post by Al Dykes
--
Al Dykes
News is something someone wants to suppress, everything else is advertising.
- Lord Northcliffe, publisher of the Daily Mail

[t***@gmail.com]

Post by Midex

Post by Al Dykes

Post by f***@gmail.com

Post by s***@gmail.com
In this article we show that "top-down" controlled demolition
accurately accounts for the collapse times of the World Trade Center
towers.

So what? =A0A collapsing building falls at 9.8 meters/second^2, whatever
causes it to collapse.
The towers collapsed because the fire weakened the steel framing,
causing the top floors to buckle. =A0Once the collapse started, it
overwhelmed the support structure below it.
-jcr

What I find interesting in the forensic engineering sense is that the
tower that was hit last fell first.
Aside from the different angles of entry, which could affect the time
to failure, the tower hit 2nd was also hit much lower, meaning there
was about twice the stresses on it.

The second tower was hit much lower and so had much more weight above
the floors that were weakened by fire and impact damage.

Thats correct Al Dykes. And then the unsupported floors above decided
to fall directly down into the greatest resistance rather than toppled
over the edge.

How exactly would flat slab floors have "toppled over the edge", eh
retard?

Post by Midex
Tell me, when you let go of a standing bicycle, does it collapse into
itself? Hey fuckwit moron? Or does it fall over side-ways?

It falls over sideways because 1) it's still structurally intact, and
2) the ground it underneath it, fuckwit

Post by Midex
Go and try it with a bicycle fuckwit moron.

Only a moron like you woulkd equate a bicycle with the WTC

[Ah man]

Post by t***@gmail.com

Post by Midex

Post by Al Dykes

Post by f***@gmail.com

Post by s***@gmail.com
In this article we show that "top-down" controlled demolition
accurately accounts for the collapse times of the World Trade Center
towers.

So what? =A0A collapsing building falls at 9.8 meters/second^2, whatever
causes it to collapse.
The towers collapsed because the fire weakened the steel framing,
causing the top floors to buckle. =A0Once the collapse started, it
overwhelmed the support structure below it.
-jcr

What I find interesting in the forensic engineering sense is that the
tower that was hit last fell first.
Aside from the different angles of entry, which could affect the time
to failure, the tower hit 2nd was also hit much lower, meaning there
was about twice the stresses on it.

The second tower was hit much lower and so had much more weight above
the floors that were weakened by fire and impact damage.

Thats correct Al Dykes. And then the unsupported floors above decided
to fall directly down into the greatest resistance rather than toppled
over the edge.

How exactly would flat slab floors have "toppled over the edge", eh
retard?

Post by Midex
Tell me, when you let go of a standing bicycle, does it collapse into
itself? Hey fuckwit moron? Or does it fall over side-ways?

It falls over sideways because 1) it's still structurally intact, and
2) the ground it underneath it, fuckwit

(1) None of the floors below the floors that are said to have failed
were structurally compromised by fire or anything.

(2)You are welcome to put the bicycle on top of metal rubbish bin.

(3) You don't have any degree in science or engineering. You Chris
Textor claim to have a degree in Arts. So what the fuck are you doing
speaking on topics you are not qualified to? Are YOU the fuckwit?
Seems so!

Post by t***@gmail.com

Post by Midex
Go and try it with a bicycle fuckwit moron.

Only a moron like you woulkd equate a bicycle with the WTC

[t***@gmail.com]

Post by Ah man

Post by t***@gmail.com

Post by Midex

Post by Al Dykes

Post by f***@gmail.com

Post by s***@gmail.com
In this article we show that "top-down" controlled demolition
accurately accounts for the collapse times of the World Trade Center
towers.

So what? =A0A collapsing building falls at 9.8 meters/second^2, whatever
causes it to collapse.
The towers collapsed because the fire weakened the steel framing,
causing the top floors to buckle. =A0Once the collapse started, it
overwhelmed the support structure below it.
-jcr

What I find interesting in the forensic engineering sense is that the
tower that was hit last fell first.
Aside from the different angles of entry, which could affect the time
to failure, the tower hit 2nd was also hit much lower, meaning there
was about twice the stresses on it.

The second tower was hit much lower and so had much more weight above
the floors that were weakened by fire and impact damage.

Thats correct Al Dykes. And then the unsupported floors above decided
to fall directly down into the greatest resistance rather than toppled
over the edge.

How exactly would flat slab floors have "toppled over the edge", eh
retard?

Post by Midex
Tell me, when you let go of a standing bicycle, does it collapse into
itself? Hey fuckwit moron? Or does it fall over side-ways?

It falls over sideways because 1) it's still structurally intact, and
2) the ground it underneath it, fuckwit

(1) None of the floors below the floors that are said to have failed
were structurally compromised by fire or anything.

Other than the small issue of the building above them collapsing on
them

Post by Ah man
(2)You are welcome to put the bicycle on top of metal rubbish bin.

LOL. That would prove there is a bicycle on top of a rubbish bin, and
exactly nothing else, retard.

Post by Ah man
(3) You don't have any degree in science or engineering.

Neither do you Jakey. Your imaginary qualifications don't actually
count, remember?

Post by Ah man
You Chris
Textor claim to have a degree in Arts. So what the fuck are you doing
speaking on topics you are not qualified to? Are YOU the fuckwit?
Seems so!

I'm not the mentally ill freak who constantly dribbles kook conspiracy
theories and who thinks a "bicycle on a garbage can" is a valid
comparison

Post by Ah man

Post by t***@gmail.com

Post by Midex
Go and try it with a bicycle fuckwit moron.

Only a moron like you woulkd equate a bicycle with the WTC

[Ah man]

Post by t***@gmail.com

Post by Ah man

Post by t***@gmail.com

Post by Midex

Post by Al Dykes

Post by f***@gmail.com

Post by s***@gmail.com
In this article we show that "top-down" controlled demolition
accurately accounts for the collapse times of the World Trade Center
towers.

So what? =A0A collapsing building falls at 9.8 meters/second^2, whatever
causes it to collapse.
The towers collapsed because the fire weakened the steel framing,
causing the top floors to buckle. =A0Once the collapse started, it
overwhelmed the support structure below it.
-jcr

What I find interesting in the forensic engineering sense is that the
tower that was hit last fell first.
Aside from the different angles of entry, which could affect the time
to failure, the tower hit 2nd was also hit much lower, meaning there
was about twice the stresses on it.

The second tower was hit much lower and so had much more weight above
the floors that were weakened by fire and impact damage.

Thats correct Al Dykes. And then the unsupported floors above decided
to fall directly down into the greatest resistance rather than toppled
over the edge.

How exactly would flat slab floors have "toppled over the edge", eh
retard?

Post by Midex
Tell me, when you let go of a standing bicycle, does it collapse into
itself? Hey fuckwit moron? Or does it fall over side-ways?

It falls over sideways because 1) it's still structurally intact, and
2) the ground it underneath it, fuckwit

(1) None of the floors below the floors that are said to have failed
were structurally compromised by fire or anything.

Other than the small issue of the building above them collapsing on
them

You're welcome to build a lego set tower and break it half way and
then lift the top half a foot above the bottom half and drop it back
down. (remember that the top of the towers were not lifted)

See what happens Chris Textor, Arts-degree Jew boy. Did the top half
topple over the side?
Now go and do it 1000 times again like a good little elementary school
kid in General Science class on static physics.

Post by t***@gmail.com

Post by Ah man
(2)You are welcome to put the bicycle on top of metal rubbish bin.

LOL. That would prove there is a bicycle on top of a rubbish bin, and
exactly nothing else, retard.

According to Arts-degree Chris Textor or the overwhelming consensus of
relevantly qualified engineers and architects?

Still waiting for you to find me even 20 architects and engineers who
support NIST's Magic Fire explanation.

Meanwhile the now 280 engineers and architects at www.ae911truth.org
will be 290 in another week. And then another week it will be 300. And
by September 11, 2008 there will likely be over 1000 degreed
professional architects and engineers who support the Controlled
Demolition conclusion.

Post by t***@gmail.com

Post by Ah man
(3) You don't have any degree in science or engineering.

Neither do you Jakey. Your imaginary qualifications don't actually
count, remember?

Oh o/k.
Chris Textor has been showed verification of my quals. Actually
ae911truth.org have verified by science degree from Melbourne Uni.
Chemsitry and Maths.

But Chris Textor is a Troll. He decided about 5 years ago that he
wanted to be an anti-intellectual and USenet is his killing ground. He
just loves to enter threads and destroy them with his smut.

Post by t***@gmail.com

Post by Ah man
You Chris
Textor claim to have a degree in Arts. So what the fuck are you doing
speaking on topics you are not qualified to? Are YOU the fuckwit?
Seems so!

I'm not the mentally ill freak who constantly dribbles kook conspiracy
theories and who thinks a "bicycle on a garbage can" is a valid
comparison

Static Physics. Its valid.

Here is another valid comparison: Pot Belly Stove. Metal doesn't melt
from fire.

Post by t***@gmail.com

Post by Ah man

Post by t***@gmail.com

Post by Midex
Go and try it with a bicycle fuckwit moron.

Only a moron like you woulkd equate a bicycle with the WTC

[t***@gmail.com]

Post by Ah man

Post by t***@gmail.com

Post by Ah man

Post by t***@gmail.com

Post by Midex

Post by Al Dykes

Post by f***@gmail.com

Post by s***@gmail.com
In this article we show that "top-down" controlled demolition
accurately accounts for the collapse times of the World Trade Center
towers.

So what? =A0A collapsing building falls at 9.8 meters/second^2, whatever
causes it to collapse.
The towers collapsed because the fire weakened the steel framing,
causing the top floors to buckle. =A0Once the collapse started, it
overwhelmed the support structure below it.
-jcr

What I find interesting in the forensic engineering sense is that the
tower that was hit last fell first.
Aside from the different angles of entry, which could affect the time
to failure, the tower hit 2nd was also hit much lower, meaning there
was about twice the stresses on it.

The second tower was hit much lower and so had much more weight above
the floors that were weakened by fire and impact damage.

Thats correct Al Dykes. And then the unsupported floors above decided
to fall directly down into the greatest resistance rather than toppled
over the edge.

How exactly would flat slab floors have "toppled over the edge", eh
retard?

Post by Midex
Tell me, when you let go of a standing bicycle, does it collapse into
itself? Hey fuckwit moron? Or does it fall over side-ways?

It falls over sideways because 1) it's still structurally intact, and
2) the ground it underneath it, fuckwit

(1) None of the floors below the floors that are said to have failed
were structurally compromised by fire or anything.

Other than the small issue of the building above them collapsing on
them

You're welcome to build a lego set tower and break it half way and
then lift the top half a foot above the bottom half and drop it back
down. (remember that the top of the towers were not lifted)

LOL. Another classic jake comparison. You could start by learning how
the WTC was built, retard. I'll give you a hint: it wasn't like a
"lego tower" or a "bicycle on a garbage can" or a piece of chicken
wire.

Post by Ah man
See what happens Chris Textor, Arts-degree Jew boy.

I'm not Jewish, Mr Jake "non-existent degrees and fake revolutionary"
McCrann

Post by Ah man
Did the top half
topple over the side?

You're the lego "expert", you tell us.

Post by Ah man
Now go and do it 1000 times again like a good little elementary school
kid in General Science class on static physics.

Gee, if only the WTC had been made out of lego, you might have a
point. Bwehehe

Post by Ah man

Post by t***@gmail.com

Post by Ah man
(2)You are welcome to put the bicycle on top of metal rubbish bin.

LOL. That would prove there is a bicycle on top of a rubbish bin, and
exactly nothing else, retard.

According to Arts-degree Chris Textor or the overwhelming consensus of
relevantly qualified engineers and architects?

You don't have an "overwhelming consensus", retard

Post by Ah man
Still waiting for you to find me even 20 architects and engineers who
support NIST's Magic Fire explanation.

Still waiting for you to find me twenty scientists who support the
existence of corn flakes.

Post by Ah man
Meanwhile the now 280 engineers and architects atwww.ae911truth.org
will be 290 in another week. And then another week it will be 300. And
by September 11, 2008 there will likely be over 1000 degreed
professional architects and engineers who support the Controlled
Demolition conclusion.

Post by t***@gmail.com

Post by Ah man
(3) You don't have any degree in science or engineering.

Neither do you Jakey. Your imaginary qualifications don't actually
count, remember?

Oh o/k.
Chris Textor has been showed verification of my quals.

What "verification" was that then jakey?

Post by Ah man
Actually
ae911truth.org have verified by science degree from Melbourne Uni.
Chemsitry and Maths.

...and how did they "verify" it, eh jake?

Why can't you answer any questions about these non-existent degrees of
yours?

Post by Ah man
But Chris Textor is a Troll. He decided about 5 years ago that he
wanted to be an anti-intellectual and USenet is his killing ground. He
just loves to enter threads and destroy them with his smut.

LOL, this coming from the mentally ill retard who threatens to kill
people and dreams about starting "revolutions" and meeting Osama

Post by Ah man

Post by t***@gmail.com

Post by Ah man
You Chris
Textor claim to have a degree in Arts. So what the fuck are you doing
speaking on topics you are not qualified to? Are YOU the fuckwit?
Seems so!

I'm not the mentally ill freak who constantly dribbles kook conspiracy
theories and who thinks a "bicycle on a garbage can" is a valid
comparison

Static Physics. Its valid.
Here is another valid comparison: Pot Belly Stove. Metal doesn't melt
from fire.

The WTC didn't collapse because it "melted", retard.

Post by Ah man

Post by t***@gmail.com

Post by Ah man

Post by t***@gmail.com

Post by Midex
Go and try it with a bicycle fuckwit moron.

Only a moron like you woulkd equate a bicycle with the WTC

[Ah man]

Post by t***@gmail.com

Post by Ah man

Post by t***@gmail.com

Post by Ah man

Post by t***@gmail.com

Post by Midex

Post by Al Dykes

Post by f***@gmail.com

Post by s***@gmail.com
In this article we show that "top-down" controlled demolition
accurately accounts for the collapse times of the World Trade Center
towers.

So what? =A0A collapsing building falls at 9.8 meters/second^2, whatever
causes it to collapse.
The towers collapsed because the fire weakened the steel framing,
causing the top floors to buckle. =A0Once the collapse started, it
overwhelmed the support structure below it.
-jcr

What I find interesting in the forensic engineering sense is that the
tower that was hit last fell first.
Aside from the different angles of entry, which could affect the time
to failure, the tower hit 2nd was also hit much lower, meaning there
was about twice the stresses on it.

The second tower was hit much lower and so had much more weight above
the floors that were weakened by fire and impact damage.

Thats correct Al Dykes. And then the unsupported floors above decided
to fall directly down into the greatest resistance rather than toppled
over the edge.

How exactly would flat slab floors have "toppled over the edge", eh
retard?

Post by Midex
Tell me, when you let go of a standing bicycle, does it collapse into
itself? Hey fuckwit moron? Or does it fall over side-ways?

It falls over sideways because 1) it's still structurally intact, and
2) the ground it underneath it, fuckwit

(1) None of the floors below the floors that are said to have failed
were structurally compromised by fire or anything.

Other than the small issue of the building above them collapsing on
them

You're welcome to build a lego set tower and break it half way and
then lift the top half a foot above the bottom half and drop it back
down. (remember that the top of the towers were not lifted)

LOL. Another classic jake comparison. You could start by learning how
the WTC was built, retard. I'll give you a hint: it wasn't like a
"lego tower" or a "bicycle on a garbage can" or a piece of chicken
wire.

Sorry Tex, what were you saying about your Arts degree?

I should explain here for other visitors of the future, that Texey is
a Strawman.
I am merely providing one of millions examples one could use to
demonstrate the inalienable law of physics and galilaeo's age old
observation of the laws of Falling Bodies and the path of least
resistance, centre of gravity, etc...

Actually Chris Textor, you are Le Idiot!

Notice how dumb the French population is today? Look at what % of the
audience answers were for the question "Does the moon orbit around the
earth or does the Sun orbit around the earth".
This is a sign of the end of civilisation.
56% of the audience said the correct answer was the Sun Rotates around
the earth!
E pur si mouve!!!!
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/E_pur_si_muove%21

Post by t***@gmail.com

Post by Ah man
See what happens Chris Textor, Arts-degree Jew boy.

I'm not Jewish, Mr Jake "non-existent degrees and fake revolutionary"
McCrann

Oh but you better be Chris Textor. Cause if you're not you are one of
the biggest Jew Whores in the Universe! Not to mention your utter lack
of any residual intellect known to humanity.

Post by t***@gmail.com

Post by Ah man
Did the top half
topple over the side?

You're the lego "expert", you tell us.

You are the ignorant bafoon who has decided to make it your life to
let the world know that Chris Textor is scientifically and
mathematically retarded.

Post by t***@gmail.com

Post by Ah man
Now go and do it 1000 times again like a good little elementary school
kid in General Science class on static physics.

Gee, if only the WTC had been made out of lego, you might have a
point. Bwehehe

never were very good at physics were you Chris Textor? Scientific
experimentation and simplification of the problem question not your
forte hey Chris Textor? I guess thats why you're so jealous of
millionaires - its beyond your wildest dreams.

Post by t***@gmail.com

Post by Ah man

Post by t***@gmail.com

Post by Ah man
(2)You are welcome to put the bicycle on top of metal rubbish bin.

LOL. That would prove there is a bicycle on top of a rubbish bin, and
exactly nothing else, retard.

According to Arts-degree Chris Textor or the overwhelming consensus of
relevantly qualified engineers and architects?

You don't have an "overwhelming consensus", retard

According to you we do. You can't even find 20 engineers and
architects who publicly support the NIST report. While many of them
don't have the courage to speak out in defiance of the obvious fraud,
they absolutely fucking refuse to disgrace themselves by publicly
supporting it.

Here are 290 architects and engineers who have spoken up and risked
their careers in defiance of the powers that be and their treason:
www.ae911truth.org

Post by t***@gmail.com

Post by Ah man
Still waiting for you to find me even 20 architects and engineers who
support NIST's Magic Fire explanation.

Still waiting for you to find me twenty scientists who support the
existence of corn flakes.

Post by Ah man
Meanwhile the now 280 engineers and architects atwww.ae911truth.org
will be 290 in another week. And then another week it will be 300. And
by September 11, 2008 there will likely be over 1000 degreed
professional architects and engineers who support the Controlled
Demolition conclusion.

Post by t***@gmail.com

Post by Ah man
(3) You don't have any degree in science or engineering.

Neither do you Jakey. Your imaginary qualifications don't actually
count, remember?

Oh o/k.
Chris Textor has been showed verification of my quals.

What "verification" was that then jakey?

Post by Ah man
Actually
ae911truth.org have verified by science degree from Melbourne Uni.
Chemsitry and Maths.

...and how did they "verify" it, eh jake?
Why can't you answer any questions about these non-existent degrees of
yours?

Post by Ah man
But Chris Textor is a Troll. He decided about 5 years ago that he
wanted to be an anti-intellectual and USenet is his killing ground. He
just loves to enter threads and destroy them with his smut.

LOL, this coming from the mentally ill retard who threatens to kill
people and dreams about starting "revolutions" and meeting Osama

Post by Ah man

Post by t***@gmail.com

Post by Ah man
You Chris
Textor claim to have a degree in Arts. So what the fuck are you doing
speaking on topics you are not qualified to? Are YOU the fuckwit?
Seems so!

I'm not the mentally ill freak who constantly dribbles kook conspiracy
theories and who thinks a "bicycle on a garbage can" is a valid
comparison

Static Physics. Its valid.
Here is another valid comparison: Pot Belly Stove. Metal doesn't melt
from fire.

The WTC didn't collapse because it "melted", retard.

Post by Ah man

Post by t***@gmail.com

Post by Ah man

Post by t***@gmail.com

Post by Midex
Go and try it with a bicycle fuckwit moron.

Only a moron like you woulkd equate a bicycle with the WTC

[Ah man]

Post by t***@gmail.com

Post by Ah man

Post by t***@gmail.com

Post by Ah man

Post by t***@gmail.com

Post by Midex

Post by Al Dykes

Post by f***@gmail.com

Post by s***@gmail.com
In this article we show that "top-down" controlled demolition
accurately accounts for the collapse times of the World Trade Center
towers.

So what? =A0A collapsing building falls at 9.8 meters/second^2, whatever
causes it to collapse.
The towers collapsed because the fire weakened the steel framing,
causing the top floors to buckle. =A0Once the collapse started, it
overwhelmed the support structure below it.
-jcr

What I find interesting in the forensic engineering sense is that the
tower that was hit last fell first.
Aside from the different angles of entry, which could affect the time
to failure, the tower hit 2nd was also hit much lower, meaning there
was about twice the stresses on it.

The second tower was hit much lower and so had much more weight above
the floors that were weakened by fire and impact damage.

Thats correct Al Dykes. And then the unsupported floors above decided
to fall directly down into the greatest resistance rather than toppled
over the edge.

How exactly would flat slab floors have "toppled over the edge", eh
retard?

Post by Midex
Tell me, when you let go of a standing bicycle, does it collapse into
itself? Hey fuckwit moron? Or does it fall over side-ways?

It falls over sideways because 1) it's still structurally intact, and
2) the ground it underneath it, fuckwit

(1) None of the floors below the floors that are said to have failed
were structurally compromised by fire or anything.

Other than the small issue of the building above them collapsing on
them

You're welcome to build a lego set tower and break it half way and
then lift the top half a foot above the bottom half and drop it back
down. (remember that the top of the towers were not lifted)

LOL. Another classic jake comparison. You could start by learning how
the WTC was built, retard. I'll give you a hint: it wasn't like a
"lego tower" or a "bicycle on a garbage can" or a piece of chicken
wire.

Post by Ah man
See what happens Chris Textor, Arts-degree Jew boy.

I'm not Jewish, Mr Jake "non-existent degrees and fake revolutionary"
McCrann

Post by Ah man
Did the top half
topple over the side?

You're the lego "expert", you tell us.

Post by Ah man
Now go and do it 1000 times again like a good little elementary school
kid in General Science class on static physics.

Gee, if only the WTC had been made out of lego, you might have a
point. Bwehehe

Post by Ah man

Post by t***@gmail.com

Post by Ah man
(2)You are welcome to put the bicycle on top of metal rubbish bin.

LOL. That would prove there is a bicycle on top of a rubbish bin, and
exactly nothing else, retard.

According to Arts-degree Chris Textor or the overwhelming consensus of
relevantly qualified engineers and architects?

You don't have an "overwhelming consensus", retard

Post by Ah man
Still waiting for you to find me even 20 architects and engineers who
support NIST's Magic Fire explanation.

Still waiting for you to find me twenty scientists who support the
existence of corn flakes.

Post by Ah man
Meanwhile the now 280 engineers and architects atwww.ae911truth.org
will be 290 in another week. And then another week it will be 300. And
by September 11, 2008 there will likely be over 1000 degreed
professional architects and engineers who support the Controlled
Demolition conclusion.

Post by t***@gmail.com

Post by Ah man
(3) You don't have any degree in science or engineering.

Neither do you Jakey. Your imaginary qualifications don't actually
count, remember?

Oh o/k.
Chris Textor has been showed verification of my quals.

What "verification" was that then jakey?

Post by Ah man
Actually
ae911truth.org have verified by science degree from Melbourne Uni.
Chemsitry and Maths.

...and how did they "verify" it, eh jake?
Why can't you answer any questions about these non-existent degrees of
yours?

Chris I showed you a copy of my degree. I have a photo of me fucking
Graduating in Wilson Hall you abosolute FUCKING MORON. I have 1000s of
people who knew me at Melbourne.
Go call the Chemistry Faculty you fuckwit.

Post by t***@gmail.com

Post by Ah man
But Chris Textor is a Troll. He decided about 5 years ago that he
wanted to be an anti-intellectual and USenet is his killing ground. He
just loves to enter threads and destroy them with his smut.

LOL, this coming from the mentally ill retard who threatens to kill
people and dreams about starting "revolutions" and meeting Osama

Post by Ah man

Post by t***@gmail.com

Post by Ah man
You Chris
Textor claim to have a degree in Arts. So what the fuck are you doing
speaking on topics you are not qualified to? Are YOU the fuckwit?
Seems so!

I'm not the mentally ill freak who constantly dribbles kook conspiracy
theories and who thinks a "bicycle on a garbage can" is a valid
comparison

Static Physics. Its valid.
Here is another valid comparison: Pot Belly Stove. Metal doesn't melt
from fire.

The WTC didn't collapse because it "melted", retard.

Post by Ah man

Post by t***@gmail.com

Post by Ah man

Post by t***@gmail.com

Post by Midex
Go and try it with a bicycle fuckwit moron.

Only a moron like you woulkd equate a bicycle with the WTC

[Tex]

Post by Ah man

Post by t***@gmail.com
Why can't you answer any questions about these non-existent degrees of
yours?

Chris I showed you a copy of my degree.

Well, you showed a piece of paper you printed out

Post by Ah man
I have a photo of me fucking
Graduating in Wilson Hall you abosolute FUCKING MORON.

So where is it then Jakey?

Post by Ah man
I have 1000s of
people who knew me at Melbourne.
Go call the Chemistry Faculty you fuckwit.

...and when they go "huh?" you'll blame "the Jews".

OK Jakey, here are some questions again about your "degrees"
- what were your dates of study for each degree?
- what were the names of your lecturers/tutors?
- what were the units you completed?

Come on Jakey. They can't be that hard to answer

[Ah man]

Post by Tex

Post by Ah man

Post by t***@gmail.com
Why can't you answer any questions about these non-existent degrees of
yours?

Chris I showed you a copy of my degree.

Well, you showed a piece of paper you printed out

Post by Ah man
I have a photo of me fucking
Graduating in Wilson Hall you abosolute FUCKING MORON.

So where is it then Jakey?

Post by Ah man
I have 1000s of
people who knew me at Melbourne.
Go call the Chemistry Faculty you fuckwit.

...and when they go "huh?" you'll blame "the Jews".
OK Jakey, here are some questions again about your "degrees"
- what were your dates of study for each degree?

You've been told this before. I graduated in

Post by Tex
- what were the names of your lecturers/tutors?

Whats the point of listing them for you? All anyone need do is go to
www.unimelb.edu.au and look at the units for Eng/Sci that were offered
between 1994-2000 and they could list all the units they allegedly did
as well as the lectuerers.

So whats the point of your question? I have already shown you a copy
of my BSc and you denied its authenticity and claimed it just MUST be
a fraud.

You are the only fraud here Chris Textor. You're a total wanker.

Also, I never claimed to have finished my BE in Chemical Engineering.
I dropped out of it in 3rd year because it was absolutely fucking
boring and the people I was studying with gave me the shits.

My Masters in Business Systems was done at Monash from 2003-2005.
Actually you can see my Monash email address on the net. Try
***@student.monash.edu


So there you go Textor.

Or if you like you can give me your residential address and I will
send you a certified copy with a BOMB in it.

Fuckwit. How many times have you demanded proof that I did some
pathetic little Bachelor of Science at Melbourne University?

Fucking moron.

Post by Tex
- what were the units you completed?
Come on Jakey. They can't be that hard to answer

[Ah man]

Post by Tex

Post by Ah man

Post by t***@gmail.com
Why can't you answer any questions about these non-existent degrees of
yours?

Chris I showed you a copy of my degree.

Well, you showed a piece of paper you printed out

ae911truth.org have also verified my degree. And then you claim that
ae911truth.org's administration cannot be trusted. And yet no-one is
claiming that the verifications of authemticity of degrees of the
signatories of ae911truth are fraudulent.

So only Chris Textor is claiming that ae911truth's verification is
fraudulent.

Of course, you could try contacting any one of the 290 verified
professional degreed architects and engineers and show us that any of
them are fraudulent.

But will you do that? Nope. Why? Because you are a TROLL FUCKWIT.

Chris Textor, you are wasting people's time with your TROLL sickness.
You should try and get help. You will have a more satisfying life if
you can get help for your mental illness.

You claim to have an Arts degree from ANU and yet you have never
provided any proof of it. In fact the most we can tell of you is that
you are an IT Support Desk non-academic staff member at ANU (heheheh -
hence you anti-intellectual hatred spewed here on Usenet. Fact is
you're jealous of your academic superiors at ANU. Poor little dumby
Chris Textor)

Post by Tex

Post by Ah man
I have a photo of me fucking
Graduating in Wilson Hall you abosolute FUCKING MORON.

So where is it then Jakey?

Post by Ah man
I have 1000s of
people who knew me at Melbourne.
Go call the Chemistry Faculty you fuckwit.

...and when they go "huh?" you'll blame "the Jews".
OK Jakey, here are some questions again about your "degrees"
- what were your dates of study for each degree?
- what were the names of your lecturers/tutors?
- what were the units you completed?
Come on Jakey. They can't be that hard to answer

[Tim Murray]

Metal doesn't melt from fire.

That's a pretty sweeping statement. Are you playing games with words,
separating [intense] fire and [sufficient] heat?

[Midex]

Post by Tim Murray

Metal doesn't melt from fire.

That's a pretty sweeping statement. Are you playing games with words,
separating [intense] fire and [sufficient] heat?

No he is not Terry JEW BOY.

It is YOU playing with words.

Open Combustion Fires Do Not Melt Steel.

Got it in your head?

But here is the part YOU probably don't know Terry JEW BOY (or feign
not) - NIST DENIES THERE WAS MOLTEN STEEL.

And yet lookie here:
=================================================


Which way they want to have it? Of course the fires didn't melt the
steel. Tell me then, what did?

[David Johnston]

On Wed, 5 Mar 2008 19:05:22 -0800 (PST), Ah man

Post by Ah man

Post by t***@gmail.com

Post by Ah man

Post by t***@gmail.com

Post by Midex

Post by Al Dykes

Post by f***@gmail.com

Post by s***@gmail.com
In this article we show that "top-down" controlled demolition
accurately accounts for the collapse times of the World Trade Center
towers.

So what? =A0A collapsing building falls at 9.8 meters/second^2, whatever
causes it to collapse.
The towers collapsed because the fire weakened the steel framing,
causing the top floors to buckle. =A0Once the collapse started, it
overwhelmed the support structure below it.
-jcr

What I find interesting in the forensic engineering sense is that the
tower that was hit last fell first.
Aside from the different angles of entry, which could affect the time
to failure, the tower hit 2nd was also hit much lower, meaning there
was about twice the stresses on it.

The second tower was hit much lower and so had much more weight above
the floors that were weakened by fire and impact damage.

Thats correct Al Dykes. And then the unsupported floors above decided
to fall directly down into the greatest resistance rather than toppled
over the edge.

How exactly would flat slab floors have "toppled over the edge", eh
retard?

Post by Midex
Tell me, when you let go of a standing bicycle, does it collapse into
itself? Hey fuckwit moron? Or does it fall over side-ways?

It falls over sideways because 1) it's still structurally intact, and
2) the ground it underneath it, fuckwit

(1) None of the floors below the floors that are said to have failed
were structurally compromised by fire or anything.

Other than the small issue of the building above them collapsing on
them

You're welcome to build a lego set tower and break it half way and
then lift the top half a foot above the bottom half and drop it back
down. (remember that the top of the towers were not lifted)

OK. So we drop it back down with 90.000 tons of force. What happens
then?

[Eric B.]

Post by David Johnston
On Wed, 5 Mar 2008 19:05:22 -0800 (PST), Ah man

Post by Ah man

Post by t***@gmail.com

Post by Ah man

Post by t***@gmail.com

Post by Midex

Post by Steve Hix
In article

On Mar 4, 6:31=A0am, John C. Randolph

Post by s***@gmail.com
In this article we show that "top-down" controlled demolition
accurately accounts for the collapse times of the World
Trade Center
towers.

So what? =A0A collapsing building falls at 9.8
meters/second^2, whatever
causes it to collapse.
The towers collapsed because the fire weakened the steel framing,
causing the top floors to buckle. =A0Once the collapse
started, it
overwhelmed the support structure below it.
-jcr

What I find interesting in the forensic engineering sense is that the
tower that was hit last fell first.
Aside from the different angles of entry, which could affect the time
to failure, the tower hit 2nd was also hit much lower, meaning there
was about twice the stresses on it.

The second tower was hit much lower and so had much more weight above
the floors that were weakened by fire and impact damage.

Thats correct Al Dykes. And then the unsupported floors above decided
to fall directly down into the greatest resistance rather than toppled
over the edge.

How exactly would flat slab floors have "toppled over the edge", eh
retard?

Post by Midex
Tell me, when you let go of a standing bicycle, does it collapse into
itself? Hey fuckwit moron? Or does it fall over side-ways?

It falls over sideways because 1) it's still structurally intact, and
2) the ground it underneath it, fuckwit

(1) None of the floors below the floors that are said to have failed
were structurally compromised by fire or anything.

Other than the small issue of the building above them collapsing on
them

You're welcome to build a lego set tower and break it half way and
then lift the top half a foot above the bottom half and drop it back
down. (remember that the top of the towers were not lifted)

OK. So we drop it back down with 90.000 tons of force. What happens
then?

Lego blocks are a perfectly equivalent substitute for concrete and steel. I
use them all the time along with by Matchbox cars to re-enact the JFK
assassination.

You must be in on the coverup.

Eric B.

[Ah man]

Post by Eric B.

Post by David Johnston
On Wed, 5 Mar 2008 19:05:22 -0800 (PST), Ah man

Post by Ah man

Post by t***@gmail.com

Post by Ah man

Post by t***@gmail.com

Post by Midex

Post by Steve Hix
In article

On Mar 4, 6:31=A0am, John C. Randolph

Post by s***@gmail.com
In this article we show that "top-down" controlled
demolition
accurately accounts for the collapse times of the World
Trade Center
towers.

So what? =A0A collapsing building falls at 9.8
meters/second^2, whatever
causes it to collapse.
The towers collapsed because the fire weakened the steel
framing,
causing the top floors to buckle. =A0Once the collapse
started, it
overwhelmed the support structure below it.
-jcr

What I find interesting in the forensic engineering sense is
that the
tower that was hit last fell first.
Aside from the different angles of entry, which could affect
the time
to failure, the tower hit 2nd was also hit much lower, meaning
there
was about twice the stresses on it.

The second tower was hit much lower and so had much more weight
above
the floors that were weakened by fire and impact damage.

Thats correct Al Dykes. And then the unsupported floors above decided
to fall directly down into the greatest resistance rather than toppled
over the edge.

How exactly would flat slab floors have "toppled over the edge", eh
retard?

Post by Midex
Tell me, when you let go of a standing bicycle, does it collapse into
itself? Hey fuckwit moron? Or does it fall over side-ways?

It falls over sideways because 1) it's still structurally intact, and
2) the ground it underneath it, fuckwit

(1) None of the floors below the floors that are said to have failed
were structurally compromised by fire or anything.

Other than the small issue of the building above them collapsing on
them

You're welcome to build a lego set tower and break it half way and
then lift the top half a foot above the bottom half and drop it back
down. (remember that the top of the towers were not lifted)

OK. So we drop it back down with 90.000 tons of force. What happens
then?

Lego blocks are a perfectly equivalent substitute for concrete and steel. I
use them all the time along with by Matchbox cars to re-enact the JFK
assassination.

Actually official investigators did in fact build lego and cardboard
recreations of the scene of the JFK assasination.

Your comment just elucidates your own lack of education in scientific
reasoning.

The lego example was given to demonstrate the law of falling bodies
and path of least resistance. You would have seen such evidence of
these laws 1000s of times in your life in nature. And yet on 9/11 you
claim to have forgotten this. The event you witnessed was impossible
without explosives i.e. it was a controlled demolition of all three
towers.

Post by Eric B.
You must be in on the coverup.
Eric B.

[Al Dykes]

Post by David Johnston
On Wed, 5 Mar 2008 19:05:22 -0800 (PST), Ah man

Post by Ah man

Post by t***@gmail.com

Post by Ah man

Post by t***@gmail.com

Post by Midex

Post by Al Dykes

Post by f***@gmail.com

Post by s***@gmail.com
In this article we show that "top-down" controlled demolition
accurately accounts for the collapse times of the World Trade Center
towers.

So what? =A0A collapsing building falls at 9.8 meters/second^2, whatever
causes it to collapse.
The towers collapsed because the fire weakened the steel framing,
causing the top floors to buckle. =A0Once the collapse started, it
overwhelmed the support structure below it.
-jcr

What I find interesting in the forensic engineering sense is that the
tower that was hit last fell first.
Aside from the different angles of entry, which could affect the time
to failure, the tower hit 2nd was also hit much lower, meaning there
was about twice the stresses on it.

The second tower was hit much lower and so had much more weight above
the floors that were weakened by fire and impact damage.

Thats correct Al Dykes. And then the unsupported floors above decided
to fall directly down into the greatest resistance rather than toppled
over the edge.

How exactly would flat slab floors have "toppled over the edge", eh
retard?

Post by Midex
Tell me, when you let go of a standing bicycle, does it collapse into
itself? Hey fuckwit moron? Or does it fall over side-ways?

It falls over sideways because 1) it's still structurally intact, and
2) the ground it underneath it, fuckwit

(1) None of the floors below the floors that are said to have failed
were structurally compromised by fire or anything.

Other than the small issue of the building above them collapsing on
them

You're welcome to build a lego set tower and break it half way and
then lift the top half a foot above the bottom half and drop it back
down. (remember that the top of the towers were not lifted)

OK. So we drop it back down with 90.000 tons of force. What happens
then?

Back away from the chalk board. You are dangerous when you try to think
in terms of physics.

[Ah man]

Post by t***@gmail.com

Post by Ah man

Post by t***@gmail.com

Post by Midex

Post by Al Dykes

Post by f***@gmail.com

Post by s***@gmail.com
In this article we show that "top-down" controlled demolition
accurately accounts for the collapse times of the World Trade Center
towers.

So what? =A0A collapsing building falls at 9.8 meters/second^2, whatever
causes it to collapse.
The towers collapsed because the fire weakened the steel framing,
causing the top floors to buckle. =A0Once the collapse started, it
overwhelmed the support structure below it.
-jcr

What I find interesting in the forensic engineering sense is that the
tower that was hit last fell first.
Aside from the different angles of entry, which could affect the time
to failure, the tower hit 2nd was also hit much lower, meaning there
was about twice the stresses on it.

The second tower was hit much lower and so had much more weight above
the floors that were weakened by fire and impact damage.

Thats correct Al Dykes. And then the unsupported floors above decided
to fall directly down into the greatest resistance rather than toppled
over the edge.

How exactly would flat slab floors have "toppled over the edge", eh
retard?

Post by Midex
Tell me, when you let go of a standing bicycle, does it collapse into
itself? Hey fuckwit moron? Or does it fall over side-ways?

It falls over sideways because 1) it's still structurally intact, and
2) the ground it underneath it, fuckwit

(1) None of the floors below the floors that are said to have failed
were structurally compromised by fire or anything.

Other than the small issue of the building above them collapsing on
them

You're welcome to build a lego set tower and break it half way and
then lift the top half a foot above the bottom half and drop it back
down. (remember that the top of the towers were not lifted)

See what happens Chris Textor, Arts-degree Jew boy. Did the top half
topple over the side?
Now go and do it 1000 times again like a good little elementary school
kid in General Science class on static physics.

Post by t***@gmail.com

Post by Ah man
(2)You are welcome to put the bicycle on top of metal rubbish bin.

LOL. That would prove there is a bicycle on top of a rubbish bin, and
exactly nothing else, retard.

According to Arts-degree Chris Textor or the overwhelming consensus of
relevantly qualified engineers and architects?

Still waiting for you to find me even 20 architects and engineers who
support NIST's Magic Fire explanation.

Meanwhile the now 280 engineers and architects at www.ae911truth.org
will be 290 in another week. And then another week it will be 300. And
by September 11, 2008 there will likely be over 1000 degreed
professional architects and engineers who support the Controlled
Demolition conclusion.

Post by t***@gmail.com

Post by Ah man
(3) You don't have any degree in science or engineering.

Neither do you Jakey. Your imaginary qualifications don't actually
count, remember?

Oh o/k.
Chris Textor has been showed verification of my quals. Actually
ae911truth.org have verified by science degree from Melbourne Uni.
Chemsitry and Maths.

But Chris Textor is a Troll. He decided about 5 years ago that he
wanted to be an anti-intellectual and USenet is his killing ground. He
just loves to enter threads and destroy them with his smut.

Post by t***@gmail.com

Post by Ah man
You Chris
Textor claim to have a degree in Arts. So what the fuck are you doing
speaking on topics you are not qualified to? Are YOU the fuckwit?
Seems so!

I'm not the mentally ill freak who constantly dribbles kook conspiracy
theories and who thinks a "bicycle on a garbage can" is a valid
comparison

Static Physics. Its valid.

Here is another valid comparison: Pot Belly Stove. Metal doesn't melt
from fire.

Post by t***@gmail.com

Post by Ah man

Post by t***@gmail.com

Post by Midex
Go and try it with a bicycle fuckwit moron.

Only a moron like you woulkd equate a bicycle with the WTC

[Al Dykes]

Post by Ah man

Post by t***@gmail.com

Post by Ah man

Post by t***@gmail.com

Post by Midex

Post by Al Dykes

Post by f***@gmail.com

Post by s***@gmail.com
In this article we show that "top-down" controlled demolition
accurately accounts for the collapse times of the World Trade Center
towers.

So what? =A0A collapsing building falls at 9.8 meters/second^2, whatever
causes it to collapse.
The towers collapsed because the fire weakened the steel framing,
causing the top floors to buckle. =A0Once the collapse started, it
overwhelmed the support structure below it.
-jcr

What I find interesting in the forensic engineering sense is that the
tower that was hit last fell first.
Aside from the different angles of entry, which could affect the time
to failure, the tower hit 2nd was also hit much lower, meaning there
was about twice the stresses on it.

The second tower was hit much lower and so had much more weight above
the floors that were weakened by fire and impact damage.

Thats correct Al Dykes. And then the unsupported floors above decided
to fall directly down into the greatest resistance rather than toppled
over the edge.

How exactly would flat slab floors have "toppled over the edge", eh
retard?

Post by Midex
Tell me, when you let go of a standing bicycle, does it collapse into
itself? Hey fuckwit moron? Or does it fall over side-ways?

It falls over sideways because 1) it's still structurally intact, and
2) the ground it underneath it, fuckwit

(1) None of the floors below the floors that are said to have failed
were structurally compromised by fire or anything.

Other than the small issue of the building above them collapsing on
them

You're welcome to build a lego set tower and break it half way and
then lift the top half a foot above the bottom half and drop it back
down. (remember that the top of the towers were not lifted)
See what happens Chris Textor, Arts-degree Jew boy. Did the top half
topple over the side?
Now go and do it 1000 times again like a good little elementary school
kid in General Science class on static physics.

Post by t***@gmail.com

Post by Ah man
(2)You are welcome to put the bicycle on top of metal rubbish bin.

LOL. That would prove there is a bicycle on top of a rubbish bin, and
exactly nothing else, retard.

According to Arts-degree Chris Textor or the overwhelming consensus of
relevantly qualified engineers and architects?
Still waiting for you to find me even 20 architects and engineers who
support NIST's Magic Fire explanation.

See below for a long list of published papers about WTC. The authors
all agree that there is no man-made explosives needed to explain the
collapse of any of the buildings at WTC.

Architects rarely have any structural engineering expertise and none
of them do for the purposes of designing one of the largest buildings
in the world. The engineering work gets contracted out to people with
P.E. in their qualifications.

How many P.Es. are there in AE911? Zero?

If there is one, what does he say? I suspect it has nothing to do
with structural engineering.


-------------------------------

A list of engineering papers that explain aspects of the collapse of
WTC1, 2, and 7 caused by fire.. Most are linked via this web page:
http://wtc7lies.googlepages.com/home




TITLE: How The Loss of One Column May Have Led To The Collapse of WTC7
http://www.structuremag.org/Archives/2007-11/SF-WTC7-Gilsanz-Nov07.pdf


The Fall of WTC 7 Dark Fire By MANUEL GARCIA, Jr
http://www.counterpunch.org/darkfire11282006.html


Practical Means for Energy-Based Analyses of Disproportionate Collapse
Potential. By: Dusenberry, Donald O.; Hamburger, Ronald O.. Journal of
Performance of Constructed Facilities, Nov2006, Vol. 20 Issue 4,
p336-348, 13p, 2 charts, 14 diagrams, 5 graphs

Stability of the World Trade Center Twin Towers Structural Frame in
Multiple Floor Fires. By: Usmani, A. S.. Journal of Engineering
Mechanics, Jun2005, Vol. 131 Issue 6, p654-657, 4p

World Trade Center Collapse-Civil Engineering Considerations. By:
Monahan, Bernard. Practice Periodical on Structural Design &
Construction, Aug2002, Vol. 7 Issue 3, p134, 2p

Building Code Changes Reflect World Trade Center Investigation. By:
Hansen, Brett. Civil Engineering (08857024), Sep2007, Vol. 77 Issue 9,
p22-25, 3p;

Progressive Collapse of Structures: Annotated Bibliography and
Comparison of Codes and Standards. By: Mohamed, Osama A.. Journal of
Performance of Constructed Facilities, Nov2006, Vol. 20 Issue 4,
p418-425, 8p

I have about 30 more if you need to do an ounce of real research.
Sorry, I didn't list any from journals limited to CTists and are not
allowed to be peer-reviewed by outside experts. I just stick to
established professional journals and true peer-review.


http://www.civil.northwestern.edu/people/bazant/PDFs/Papers/405.pdf

http://web.archive.org/web/20011031095744/http://www.tam.uiuc.edu/news/200109wtc/

http://web.archive.org/web/20011031095744/http://www.tam.uiuc.edu/news/200109wtc/



The ASCE Pentagon Building Performance Report (PDF)


NIST Answers to Frequently Asked Questions About the WTC 1&2 Collapses - August, 2006
New - NIST Answers to Frequently Asked Questions - Supplement - December, 2007


NIST Final Reports on WTC 1 & 2

NIST NCSTAR 1: Federal Building and Fire Safety Investigation of the World Trade Center Disaster: Final Report of the National Construction Safety Team on the Collapses of the World Trade Center Towers

NCSTAR 1-1 Design, Construction, and Maintenance of Structural and Life Safety Systems
NCSTAR 1-2 Baseline Structural Performance and Aircraft Impact Damage Analysis of the WTC Towers
NCSTAR 1-3 Mechanical and Metallurgical Analysis of Structural Steel
NCSTAR 1-4 Active Fire Protection Systems
NCSTAR 1-5 Reconstruction of the Fires in the World Trade Center Towers
NCSTAR 1-6 Structural Fire Response and Probable Collapse Sequence of the World Trade Center Towers
NCSTAR 1-7 Occupant Behavior, Egress, and Emergency Communication
NCSTAR 1-8 The Emergency Response Operations


Investigations leading to alternate tower collapse hypotheses, and
critiques of NIST's WTC investigation by knowledgeable people who are
not conspiracy theorists: FEMA/ASCE, Arup Fire, University of
Edinburgh, Usmani, Torero, Lane, Cherepanov, Quintiere, Corbett,
Mackey, Greening

Peer-reviewed papers and conference papers about the WTC impacts, fires, and collapses



WTC collapse papers with Zdenek Bazant as lead author

May, 2007: Collapse of the World Trade Center Towers: What caused it and what didn't Co-authors Le, Greening & Benson. Refutation of controlled demolition theory. Discusses matching of video record with progressive collapse equations, "free-fall" claims, concrete crushing (and how much TNT equivalent would be needed to do that crushing), air pressure & ejection of air, spread of dust cloud.

June, 2006: Mechanics of Progressive Collapse: Learning from World Trade Center and Building Demolitions Co-author Verdure. PDF.

Excerpt (applies to link above and below): The kinetic energy of the top part of the tower impacting the floor below was found to be about 8.4x larger than the plastic energy absorption capability of the underlying story, and considerably higher than that if fracturing were taken into account (Bazant and Zhou 2002a). This fact, along with the fact that during the progressive collapse of underlying stories the loss of gravitational potential per story is much greater than the energy dissipated per story, was sufficient for Bazant and Zhou (2002a) to conclude, purely on energy grounds, that the tower was doomed once the top part of the tower dropped through the height of one story (or even 0.5 m).

Bazant & Zhou, 2001-2002: Why Did the World Trade Center Collapse?-Simple Analysis


Other explanations of the tower collapses

November, 2007: Structural Engineer Keith Seffen'smathematical model of WTC tower progressive collapse (PDF. Due to appear in the Journal of Engineering Mechanics, Vol. 134, No. 2, February 2008)
BBC News article about Seffen's paper

Dr. Frank Greening's papers on the Collapses, Energy Transfer, "Tipping," Concrete Pulverization (PDFs)

Physicist Manuel Garcia's Counterpunch articles on the physics of the WTC collapses Pt.1- Pt.2- Pt.3



Why didn't the towers, or the upper portions of them, topple over?

Why didn't the upper part pivot about it's base? See Bazant & Zhou (2001) Appendix II
Eduardo Kausel (MIT): Why the Towers didn't fall like trees
Frank Greening: An analysis of the tipping of the upper section of WTC 2 (PDF)
A simple graphic explanation of why the top of the south tower didn't fall to the side.
Physicist Dave Rogers on tipping of tower tops.
Structural engineer "Newton's Bit" on "tipping"



Explanations of NIST's Investigation Methods
See also: Investigations leading to alternate collapse hypotheses.

NIST's Investigation of the Sept. 11 World Trade Center Disaster: FAQ (2002: Goals & Methods)

Ryan Mackey on how the NIST investigation works, and on "Scholars" critics
Ryan Mackey on NIST's degree of certainty, bounding cases, comparisons to other studies
Ryan Mackey on NIST altering model inputs
Ryan Mackey on NIST recovered steel and fire models
JREF Ktesibios on NIST workstation actual tests
JREF RWGuinn on testing models to failure
Ryan Mackey on NIST fuel load estimates
Physicist Dave Rogers on scaling issues with physical models of large structures


NIST's Recommendations, and the Architectural and Engineering Community's Response

NIST summary of WTC 1 & 2 investigation results & recommendations (PDF)

The AIA's Response to NIST's Draft Report and Recommendations (PDF)

The World Trade Center Collapse and its Implications for International Standards - W. Gene Corley ISO Focus, January 2004 (PDF)

"Reexamining Premises for High-Rise Design" Security Management magazine (PDF)
In this article from Security Management magazine, Dr. Gene Corley discusses lessons from the World Trade Center investigation and how they might affect future building design.

NIBS Building Code Experts: Translating WTC Recommendations into Model Building Codes

First Comprehensive Set of Model Code Changes Adopted Based on Recommendations from Commerce's NIST World Trade Center Investigation (June, 2007)


Twin Towers' Structural Engineers on the Record

Excellent New Yorker Profile of WTC chief engineer Leslie Robertson, early speculation about collapses, many quotes from engineers, info about skyscraper design

Leslie Robertson on WTC steel core

No Tower Can Withstand Attack As Jets Get Bigger, Expert Says (Les Robertson $ NYT March 14, 2002)

"Reflections on the World Trade Center" (Robertson. PDF)

Jon Magnusson of Skilling Ward, helped design towers: "Engineers couldn't have known"



Gene Corley on FEMA/ASCE investigation lessons

"What We Learned: Building Performance Study of the WTC Collapse" (PDF) Outlines preliminary lessons learned in the FEMA/ASCE investigation of the NY World Trade Center collapse.

"Corley, ASCE Take Part in House Hearing" (PDF) On March 6, CTLGroup senior vice president Dr. Gene Corley testified before the Committee on Science of the U.S. House of Representatives. Dr. Corley was one of several members of the ASCE structural investigation team who were asked to discuss the performance of the World Trade Center in the September 11th attacks, and its implications for future building design. An article on the hearing from ASCE News.

"Looking Back on 9/11" (PDF) In this interview, Dr. Gene Corley discusses engineers' roles in the World Trade Center Building Performance Study


Abolhassan Astaneh-Asl's WTC collapse investigations

Tower Wreckage Reveals Clues - Astaneh - Jersey City Scrap Yards (later, some of these conclusions proved wrong)

Abolhassan Astaneh-Asl WTC Collapse, Field Investigations, and Analysis (Dec. 2003)

Now, as the five-year anniversary of the World Trade Center attack draws near, Astaneh-Asl finally expects to have the results of his analysis published in an academic journal. The project, requiring thousands of hours to complete, was self-funded and conducted by Astaneh-Asl, his students, and analysts from the MSC.Software Corporation, which donated the structural analysis software (MD Nastran and Dytran). Did the Building Do it? (Astaneh Study)

Testimony of Abolhassan Astaneh-Asl Before the House Committee on Science, March, 2002



Investigations involving extensive computer modeling of the towers

April, 2007: Purdue University analysis of WTC 1 collapse using LS-Dyna**More on the Purdue WTC study

"Did the Building Do It?" (Article about Abolhassan Astaneh-Asl/Cal FEA study, Sept, 2006)
Now, as the five-year anniversary of the World Trade Center attack draws near, Astaneh-Asl finally expects to have the results of his analysis published in an academic journal. The project, requiring thousands of hours to complete, was self-funded and conducted by Astaneh-Asl, his students, and analysts from the MSC.Software Corporation, which donated the structural analysis software (MD Nastran and Dytran).

NIST's SAP reference models of WTC 1&2, obtained through FOIA request

LU Xinzheng & JIANG Jianjing Simulation for the Collapse of WTC after Aeroplane Impact. Proceedings of the International Conference on the Protection of Structures Against Hazards, Nov. 2002. 57~60

Weidlinger Report Ties WTC Collapses to Column Failures (Matthys Levy). 10/25/02
The engineering team is comprised of: Weidlinger Associates Inc., led by Matthys Levy and Najib Abboud; LZA Technology/Thornton-Tomasetti Group, led by Daniel Cuoco and Gary Panariello; ARUPFire, led by Richard Custer; Hughes Associates Inc., led by Craig Beyler; SafirRosetti, led by Howard Safir; Hillman Environmental Group, led by Christopher Hillmann and John B. Glass Jr.; RWDI, led by Peter Irwin; Dr. W. Gene Corley, who led the ASCE-FEMA study; Professor Sean Ahearn; and Z-Axis Corp., led by Gary Freed and Alan Treibitz.

Weidlinger Study - Column failures

Weidlinger study refutes FEMA. Collapse inevitable due to structural damage and fires, not to WTC design defects. (NYT Oct 22, 2002)

First Tower to Fall Was hit at Higher Speed, Study Finds (NYT February 23, 2002)

Silverstein Sending Tower Data to U.S. Agency (NIST/Weidlinger/Insurance Agencies NYT Oct 1, 2002)
Even though the exterior columns all looked identical, both the grade and thickness of their steel varied from place to place, said Dr. Fahim Sadek, a researcher at the institute's building and fire research lab, who is producing a detailed structural model of the towers on a computer using the original blueprints. So there were actually more than 130 different column types, he said, each having to be accounted for in his model. From there, it gets only more intricate. One of Dr. Sadek's detailed models for a single floor -- the 96th floor of the north tower, considered typical -- contains 40,000 separate elements. A coarser representation of the entire tower contains 90,000 elements.

Swiss Re/Exponent Failure Analysis Associates WTC engineering study, Oct. 2002 (Complete copies of the FaAA study are available at Swiss Re by calling 212-317-5663.)

Ming Wang, Peter Chang, James Quintiere, and Andre Marshall "Scale Modeling of the 96th Floor of World Trade Center Tower 1" Journal of Performance of Constructed Facilities Volume 21, Issue 6, pp. 414-421 http://forums.randi.org/showthread.php?p=3161860#post3161860

Applied Reseach Associates NIST World Trade Center Investigations

Aircraft Impact Analysis of the World Trade Center Towers (Univ. of Tsukuba)

Jay Windley's (Jay Utah of BAUT forum) excellent explanation of Finite Element Analysis

Structure Magazine: Computer Modeling of the Collapse of the World Trade Center Towers (March, 2007)

CAD Digest article with CAD graphics (September, 2001) G. Charles Clifton

NIST's SAP reference models of WTC 1&2, obtained through FOIA request



More on WTC engineering, articles by and about engineers
who worked on the buildings and on the investigations

STRUCTURAL ENGINEERS AT GROUND ZERO - NCSEA (August Domel, Nov. 2001)

The Days After, the Days Ahead: Civil engineers respond to 9/11 Attacks (Civil Engineering, Nov. 2001)

Structural engineers first in the aftermath

Civil Engineering Magazine: Dissecting the Collapses

Articles in the National Academy of Engineering's "The Bridge" Spring, 2002 (PDF):

* Editorial: Engineering and Homeland Defense by George Bugliarello
* World Trade Center "Bathtub": From Genesis to Armageddon by George J. Tamaro The engineer who oversaw the construction of the World Trade Center "bathtub" describes the recovery efforts.
* A 911 Call to the Engineering Profession by Robert Prieto The events of September 11 challenged the future of our heavily engineered environment and the future of the engineering profession.

Early Structural Investigation Teams (through 5/02)

ASCE WTC Disaster Response Team

Engineer Tim Schenck on early GZ work

Multidisciplinary Center for Earthquake Engineering Research (MCEER) The World Trade Center Terrorist Attack: Damage to Critical Facilities and Crisis Response

Georgia Tech Engineering Team Will Conduct Post-Disaster Assessment at World Trade Center Attack Site

Architecture Week: Engineers Explain Collapses (5/2002)

Towers Lost and Beyond: 8 Articles by MIT researchers 2001-2002.

Civil Engineer: WTC & Pentagon Links Portal

Blog: Civil & structural engineers on WTC collapse

Forum on Technical Implications of WTC Collapses (Columbia U., November, 2001)

MIT Masters Thesis: WTC Disaster Analysis & Recommendations (June, 2005)

Designing tall buildings to Resist Earthquakes ($ NYT 2002)

Institute of Structural Engineers: Safety in tall buildings and other buildings of large occupancy ($ 2002)

9/17/01 Inferno Heat, Not Impact, Brought Down Towers, Experts Say

9/19/01: Space.com "Gravity Helped Destroy Twin Towers" concrete too heavy for core construction, walls seen buckling, seismic data


Others write about sensibly about the collapses

JREF Nobby Nobbs: Some basics on the physics of the collapses
Bautforum: Jay Utah's excellent explanation of Finite Element Analysis
JREF R. Mackey on Gordon Ross / Frank Greening debate
JREF R.Mackey on freefall and energy available for deformation
JREF R. Mackey on Judy Wood's "Math"
JREF Arkan on tower collapse times
JREF Myriad on kinetic energy of initial collapses
JREF rwguinn on structural steel deformation
JREF Dr. Adequate on Steven Jones' "handwaving" argument.
Physics kinetic energy Moscatelli The destructive forces unleashed
Steven Jones to Jim Fetzer: grand piano speed, damage to bathtub Judy Wood
JREF Kookbreaker on pancake collapse history
Ryan Mackey on independent validations of the NIST report.
Roberts: Were the towers as strong as they were designed to be?
JREF rwguinn: The engineers in my office thought the towers would collapse



More about the NIST & FEMA investigations

In Collapsing Towers, a Cascade of Failures ($ NYT Nov. 11, 2001)

Experts Urging Broader Inquiry In Towers' Fall (NYT Glanz, steel removal, Dec 25, 2001)

NIST to take over collapse investigation ($ NYT January 17, 2002)

Critique of FEMA WTC report by Ed Schulte in Plumbing Engineer, July, 2005 (PDF)

Learning from 9/11 (March, 2002) Hearing before the House Committee on Science: ASCE/FEMA BPAT study

Mismanagement Muddled Collapse Inquiry, House Panel Says (FEMA/NYC gov't/Fed gov't. $ NYT March 7, 2002)

At one point, Representative Anthony D. Weiner, a Democrat from New York City, asked for the official in charge to raise his hand, and two men, and then three appeared to do so. ''We have very serious problems here,'' added Representative John B. Larson, a Connecticut Democrat.

The lack of clear authority has had unfortunate consequences, the House members said. The Giuliani administration started to send World Trade Center steel off to recycling yards before investigators could examine it to determine whether it might hold crucial clues as to why the buildings fell.

The full investigative team set up by FEMA was not allowed to enter ground zero to collect other potentially critical evidence in the weeks after the attack, and it did not get a copy of the World Trade Center blueprints until early January, a delay House members found infuriating.

'The delay in the receipt of the plans did somewhat hinder the team's ability to confirm their understanding of the buildings,'' said Dr. W. Gene Corley, a structural engineer leading the investigative committee organized by FEMA.

A Port Authority spokesman defended the agency, saying that building plans had been given to federal officials within a week of the attack and that the agency was cooperating fully with the inquiry.

The federal officials who testified yesterday -- Dr. Arden L. Bement Jr., the director of the National Institute of Standards and Technology, and Robert F. Shea, the acting administrator of the Federal Emergency Management Agency's Insurance and Mitigation Administration -- repeatedly nodded their agreement.

In response to criticism from one committee member, Mr. Shea said, ''Frankly, I agree with you. There are many things in hindsight we would have done differently.''

The problem, they said, was the lack of clear authority in federal law and financing. None of the investigators, for example, had subpoena power, meaning that they could not order the city to stop sending the steel off for recycling or demand a copy of the building blueprints.


Government Orders Inquiry Into Trade Center Collapse ($ NYT March 23, 2002)

The Trade Center; Towers Fell as Intense Fire Beat Defenses, Report Says (FEMA. $ NYT March 29, 2002)

Interviews will examine why trade center collapsed -100,000 workers issued security passes

Wider Inquiry Into Towers Is Proposed ($ NYT May 2, 2002)

"In Data Trove, a Graphic Look at Towers' Fall, ($ NYT October 29, 2002)

Twin Tower Collapse Theory Challenged (Feb. 2003)

NIST Minutes of December 2-3, 2003, Meeting

New Evidence Is Reported That Floors Failed on 9/11 ($ NYT Dec. 3, 2003)
S. Shyam Sunder, who is leading the investigation for the National Institute of Standards and Technology in the Commerce Department, said, ''We are seeing evidence of floors appearing to be sagging -- or that had been damaged -- prior to collapse.'' Still, Dr. Sunder said, ''The relative role of the floors and the columns still remain to be determined in the collapse.''

NIST Not Ruling Anything Out on WTC Probe

Reliving 9/11, With Fire as Teacher (Modeling. $ NYT, Jan. 6, 2004)

NIST Public Briefing 05/05/04

Fire Testing Is Questioned In Findings On Towers (Current testing standards for new buildings inadequate. $ NYT August 26, 2004)


WTC Twin Tower Construction Details Pertinent to Engineering Investigations
See also WTC Construction, Systems, Power and WTC Core Construction

Gregory Urich: Detailed Estimate of Mass and Potential Energy of World Trade Center Tower (pdf)
WTC 1 & 2 core column data
Report of WTC fire code compliance--1993 (pdf)


Some Progressive Collapse Studies & Recommendations
Thanks to JREF forum member cmcaulif for his contributions

Progressive Collapse Basics (R. Shankar Nair. 2004 North American Steel Construction Conference. PDF)

Fire Induced Progressive Collapse. (Arup. PDF) "This paper considers issues related to fire induced progressive collapse of tall buildings in extreme events."

Fire induced progressive collapse analysis of high rise buildings

NISTIR 7396 "Best Practices for Reducing the Potential for Progressive Collapse in Buildings," February 2007

Above report based on NIST/SEI workshops. Workshop presentation materials are here.

Abolhassan Astaneh-Asl: Progressive collapse prevention in new and existing buildings (Includes use of catenary action of cables to resist collapse. 2003. pdf).

Practical Means for Energy-Based Analyses of Disproportionate Collapse Potential
Journal of Performance of Constructed Facilities, Volume 20, Issue 4, pp. 336-348 (November 2006)

Progressive Analysis Procedure for Progressive Collapse
Journal of Performance of Constructed Facilities, Volume 18, Issue 2, pp. 79-85 (May 2004)

Progressive Collapse of Structures: Annotated Bibliography and Comparison of Codes and Standards
Journal of Performance of Constructed Facilities, Volume 20, Issue 4, pp. 418-425 (November 2006)



Some Engineering & physics fundamentals & calculation aids

Efunda: Engineering Fundamentals
Online scientific calculator and unit converter
Shear Force And Bending diagrams 1
Ductile fracture and fragmentation in the reconstruction of the World Trade Center Attack (Wierzbicki)
Elastic Bending Theory
JREF: PixyMIsa on truther misuse of the term "entropy"
JREF Structural Engineer Newtons Bit on DCR/dead/live loads/safety factor
Steel: Ultimate strength vs. yield strength (strength is in the geometry)
A demonstration of kinetic energy: 7 grams of plastic vs. cast aluminum block

Main 9/11 Links Page



Fire Safety Engineering & the Performance of Structural Steel in Fires

Main 9/11 Links Page
See also Investigations leading to alternate tower collapse hypotheses, and critiques of NIST's
WTC investigation by knowledgeable people who are not conspiracy theorists


A few examples of structural steel failing in building fires

Large multistory steel-framed factory buildings quickly collapse due to fire Go

Unprotected steel fails in Madrid's Windsor Building fire, concrete core stands. Go

Collapse mechanism of the Madrid Windsor Building Go

BBC Report: Windsor building fire Go

Unprotected steel truss roof quickly fails in fire at McCormick Place, Chicago Go

Fire damage to protected steel in One Meridian Plaza, Philadelphia Go

Noises in steel buildings during fire equals danger! Go

JREF, Unfit4Command: Examples of steel destroyed by fire Go

Steel fails in paper factory fire Go

A building fire and structural failure (Steel buildings collapse due to fire) Go

Loss of fireproofing on steel leads to collapse (PDF) Go


NIST and FEMA Experiments, Studies, and Reports

NCSTAR 1-1 Design, Construction, and Maintenance of Structural and Life Safety Systems
NCSTAR 1-4 Active Fire Protection Systems
NCSTAR 1-5 Reconstruction of the Fires in the World Trade Center Towers
NCSTAR 1-6 Structural Fire Response and Probable Collapse Sequence of the World Trade Center Towers
NCSTAR 1-7 Occupant Behavior, Egress, and Emergency Communication
NCSTAR 1-8 The Emergency Response Operations

FEMA 403 Appendix A: Overview of Fire Protection in Buildings (pdf) Go

NIST: Fire Protection of Structural Steel in High-Rise buildings (white paper) Go

Underwriters Labs post-9/11 WTC fire testing, ASTM E119 standard Go

NIST early WTC fire simulation experiments and photos Go

Report of WTC fire code compliance--1993 (pdf Released via nistreview.org FOIA request) Go

NIST's Safety of Threatened Buildings Research Projects

NIST: 2-D Analysis of a Building Frame Under Gravity Load and Fire.

Fire Protection Engineering: "The future of fire simulation at NIST" (PDF)

NIST Gallery of WTC Fire Experiment #6

NIST project 6 structural fire response & collapse analysis

NIST Collected Publications Related to the Use of Elevators During Fires

Fire Protection Engineering Magazine on Computer Modeling / NIST

NIST fire tests: steel residential floor assemblies last 4 mins.

Similar test to above: steel lasts 4.5 minutes, wood, 9 minutes.


Some comments on Fire Testing and Modeling in the NIST WTC 1&2 report

FIRE CHIEFS REPORT ON 9/11 COMMISSION REPORT

Ryan Mackey on NIST recovered steel and fire models Go

JREF Ktesbios on NIST workstation actual tests Go

JREF RWGuinn on testing models to failure Go

Ryan Mackey on NIST fuel load estimates Go


Building Code Changes and Recommendations Resulting from WTC Collapses

Sally Regenhard Calls for New High-Rise Codes and Code Group Composition (Fire Engineering Mag. 4/02)

Engineering News-Record: Skyscrapers' Supporters Infuriated By Fire Fearmongers (response to Regenhard & SyscraperSafety.org)

SWEEPING CHANGES PUSHED FOR CODE ON CITY HIGH-RISES (NYT Aug 2, 2002)

City Reshaping Building Codes To U.S. Model (NYT May 17, 2004)

9/11 Has Spurred Only Modest Changes in New York City and National Building Codes (NYT 9/9/06)

First Comprehensive Set of Model Code Changes Adopted Based on Recommendations from Commerce's NIST World Trade Center Investigation (June, 2007)

NYC Building Code - Fire Protection

UK reached same NIST conclusions 3 years earlier: ARUP, New Civil Engineer Plus Go

NYC Dept. of Buildings WTC Task Force recommendations report Go

NIST summary of WTC 1 & 2 investigation results & recommendations (PDF)

The AIA's Response to NIST's Draft Report and Recommendations (PDF)

The World Trade Center Collapse and its Implications for International Standards - W. Gene Corley ISO Focus, January 2004 (PDF)

"Reexamining Premises for High-Rise Design" Security Management magazine (PDF)
In this article from Security Management magazine, Dr. Gene Corley discusses lessons from the World Trade Center investigation and how they might affect future building design.

NIBS Building Code Experts: Translating WTC Recommendations into Model Building Codes

TOWERS' COLLAPSE RAISES NEW DOUBTS ABOUT FIRE TESTS (NYT April 8, 2002)
''If I say, 'That product passed the test,' you as John Q. Public may be happy,'' said Dr. James G. Quintiere, a professor in fire protection engineering at the University of Maryland. ''But if we say, 'It passed the test, but we don't know how it will function in your house,' you would not be happy.''

TOWERS UNTESTED FOR MAJOR FIRE, INQUIRY SUGGESTS (NYT May 8, 2003)
Federal investigators studying the collapse of the twin towers on Sept. 11, 2001, say they now believe that the Port Authority of New York and New Jersey, the government agency that built the towers, never performed the fundamental tests needed to determine how their innovative structures would perform in a fire


Papers and articles about fire vs. structural steel, specific to the WTC

The behavior of lightweight composite floor trusses in fire Go

Did the Ban on Asbestos Lead to Loss of Life? (Guy Tozzoli, 707, PA discontinued asbestos use before required to do so. $ NYT 9/18/01)

Asbestos Use in the Construction of the World Trade Center

Faulty Fireproofing Is Reviewed as Factor in Trade Center Collapse (Frederick Mowrer, Alan REiss, Roger Morse. $ NYT Dec 13, 2001)

Comparing 2 Sets Of Twin Towers; Malaysian Buildings Offered as Model (Charles Thornton on Petronas Towers / High-strength concrete / Robertson / Nordenson NYT Oct. 23, 2002)

Some interesting thoughts on WTC fire protection, steel vs. concrete, redundancy, new materials Go

Charles H. Thornton, a structural engineer who is co-chairman of the Thornton-Tomasetti Group and also a member of the investigation's advisory committee, said the work would go a long way toward putting the field on a par with research on weaponry and space travel, which also require precise calculation of the effects of heat and blast on structures. ''It's never been done before in the building industry,'' said Mr. Thornton, who collaborated in the design of the Petronas Towers in Kuala Lumpur, Malaysia, currently the world's tallest structures. Especially puzzling is that the analysis of hazards posed by earthquakes and high winds has far outstripped similar work on fires. But just as earthquake engineering lurched forward after the major California quakes of 1971, 1989 and 1994, fire science is advancing after the events of Sept. 11, 2001. Reliving 9/11, With Fire as Teacher (NYT Jan 6, 2004)

Role of Fire Resistance Issues in the Collapse of the Twin Towers (PDF. Institute for Research in Construction, Canada)


Papers and articles about fire vs. structural steel, not specific to the WTC

Restrained fire resistance ratings in structural steel buildings Go

Structural Fire Engineering: Database: Cardington Fire Test Data Go

JREF: Dave_46 on the Cardington Lab Tests

Determination of fire induced collapse mechanisms of multi-story steel framed structures Go

A New Approach to Multi-Storey Steel Framed Buildings Fire and Steel Construction.

Rein et all, Multi-Story Fire Analysis for High Rise Buildings, 11th Interflam, London, September 2007

Performance of unprotected steel and composite steel frames exposed to fire (Master's Thesis) Go
Effect of Support Conditions on Steel Beams Exposed of Fire (Master's Thesis) Go
Fire safety engineering forum (numerous papers) Go

Recent advances in fire-structure analysis. Fire Safety Journal, In Press, Corrected Proof, Available online 20 August 2007, Dat Duthinh, Kevin McGrattan and Abed Khaskia

Coupled fire dynamics and thermal response of complex building structures. Proceedings of the Combustion Institute, Volume 30, Issue 2, January 2005, Pages 2255-2262 Kuldeep Prasad and Howard R. Baum

"Cabling in commercial buildings is frequently in close proximity to structural steel beams - which can lose structural integrity at fire temperatures as low as 800 degrees centigrade. Combustible cabling can burn at temperatures as high as 1,000 degrees centigrade - sufficient to cause the collapse of tall buildings under certain conditions.

The average ten-story commercial building with 100 office workstations per floor can contain more than 1 million feet of combustible "exception" cabling in concealed spaces; equivalent to the fuel load of 1,500 gallons of gasoline." http://www.cablefireresearch.org/cabling/risk.asp



Skyscraper fire protection in practice after 9/11, innovations, proposals

The discipline of structural fire protection after 9/11 Go

Arup: Innovative Structural Engineering for Tall builings in Fire (2005, PDF) Go

Arup Fire - Fire engineers present latest tall building structural response in severe fire studies (2005) Go

Structural fire engineering: Free advice from structural fire group in Manchester University. Go

Fire and Structures: The Implications of the World Trade Center (PDF) Go

Scientific American: New Thinking to Make Skyscrapers Safer Go

A Midtown Skyscraper Quietly Adds Armor (Citigroup Center NYT Aug 15, 2002)

Report Sees Lower Towers That Can Empty Faster (NYT March 28, 2002)

9/11 Prompts New Caution In Design of U.S. Skyscrapers (300 Mad., NYT Bldg, AOL Time Warner. NYT Sept. 9, 2002)

Structural Fire Engineering, World Trade Center Incident (9-11) & Fire Serviceability Limit States

Interact Fire Solutions--Passive Fire Protection using cast epoxy intumescent

Scientific American: New thinking to make skyscrapers safer

Interesting approach to protecting steel using fluid in channels

Cables hold promise in protecting existing buildings from bombs, researchers find

ARCHITECTURE; High Anxiety (Freedom Tower. NYT March 14, 2004)

The Fire Next Time: Skyscraper safety: the push for NY's high-rises to learn not to burn (VV July 5, 2005)



Increasing use of concrete in skyscrapers.

Astaneh recommends concrete shear walls

Lloyd's commissions study: King Concrete - 08 December 2001 - New Scientist

Concrete: Changing Uses Post-9/11 (New York Construction News May, 2003)

Public Issues and the World Trade Center Disaster (Masonry Contractors Association)

Features of the new WTC 7

Video: New WTC 7: safety and structural features



Fire engineering history, general publications

Dr. James Quintiere presentation on the history of fire science, fire science & education (PDF)

Eurocode: Introduction to Structural Fire Engineering (Powerpoint presentation) Go

Fire Engineering archives (subscription) and FDNY Chief Hayden podcasts (free)

Structural Fire Engineering One Stop Shop

Publications of the Fire Safety Association

Book: Collapse of Burning Buildings : A Guide to Fireground Safety - Vincent Dunn Go



Links to several fire studies from Peter, an architect with experience in designing high-rises

Publications of the University of Sheffield Fire Engineering Research Program Go

Arup Fire on Tall Buildings and the Events of 9/11 Go

Determination of Fire Induced Collapse Mechanisms of Multi-Storey Steel Framed Structures Go


Miscellaneous related links

AIA Building Security Through Design

Where does black smoke come from? (dark vs. light smoke explanation)

Oil rig destroyed in two hours by fire.

Elevator shaft smoke explosion Boston Go

Physicist Manuel Garcia Jr.: The Thermodynamics of 9/11 Go

Chris Marrion of ARUP USA Go

Book: Why Buildings Fall Down (great for the layman)


Main 9/11 Links Page

[Ah man]

Post by Al Dykes

Post by Ah man

Post by t***@gmail.com

Post by Ah man

Post by t***@gmail.com

Post by Midex

Post by Al Dykes

Post by f***@gmail.com

Post by s***@gmail.com
In this article we show that "top-down" controlled demolition
accurately accounts for the collapse times of the World Trade Center
towers.

So what? =A0A collapsing building falls at 9.8 meters/second^2, whatever
causes it to collapse.
The towers collapsed because the fire weakened the steel framing,
causing the top floors to buckle. =A0Once the collapse started, it
overwhelmed the support structure below it.
-jcr

What I find interesting in the forensic engineering sense is that the
tower that was hit last fell first.
Aside from the different angles of entry, which could affect the time
to failure, the tower hit 2nd was also hit much lower, meaning there
was about twice the stresses on it.

The second tower was hit much lower and so had much more weight above
the floors that were weakened by fire and impact damage.

Thats correct Al Dykes. And then the unsupported floors above decided
to fall directly down into the greatest resistance rather than toppled
over the edge.

How exactly would flat slab floors have "toppled over the edge", eh
retard?

Post by Midex
Tell me, when you let go of a standing bicycle, does it collapse into
itself? Hey fuckwit moron? Or does it fall over side-ways?

It falls over sideways because 1) it's still structurally intact, and
2) the ground it underneath it, fuckwit

(1) None of the floors below the floors that are said to have failed
were structurally compromised by fire or anything.

Other than the small issue of the building above them collapsing on
them

You're welcome to build a lego set tower and break it half way and
then lift the top half a foot above the bottom half and drop it back
down. (remember that the top of the towers were not lifted)
See what happens Chris Textor, Arts-degree Jew boy. Did the top half
topple over the side?
Now go and do it 1000 times again like a good little elementary school
kid in General Science class on static physics.

Post by t***@gmail.com

Post by Ah man
(2)You are welcome to put the bicycle on top of metal rubbish bin.

LOL. That would prove there is a bicycle on top of a rubbish bin, and
exactly nothing else, retard.

According to Arts-degree Chris Textor or the overwhelming consensus of
relevantly qualified engineers and architects?
Still waiting for you to find me even 20 architects and engineers who
support NIST's Magic Fire explanation.

See below for a long list of published papers about WTC. The authors
all agree that there is no man-made explosives needed to explain the
collapse of any of the buildings at WTC.
Architects rarely have any structural engineering expertise and none
of them do for the purposes of designing one of the largest buildings
in the world. The engineering work gets contracted out to people with
P.E. in their qualifications.
How many P.Es. are there in AE911? Zero?

There are roughly 100 P.Es. There are more P.Es at ae911truth than in
your little NIST list of payrole liars.

Havn't you ever even looked at the website? Got your jewish head in
the sand have you Al Dykes?

Here:
http://www.ae911truth.org/signpetition.php

Post by Al Dykes
If there is one, what does he say? I suspect it has nothing to do
with structural engineering.
-------------------------------
A list of engineering papers that explain aspects of the collapse of
http://wtc7lies.googlepages.com/home
TITLE: How The Loss of One Column May Have Led To The Collapse of WTC7
http://www.structuremag.org/Archives/2007-11/SF-WTC7-Gilsanz-Nov07.pdf
The Fall of WTC 7 Dark Fire By MANUEL GARCIA, Jr
http://www.counterpunch.org/darkfire11282006.html
Practical Means for Energy-Based Analyses of Disproportionate Collapse
Potential. By: Dusenberry, Donald O.; Hamburger, Ronald O.. Journal of
Performance of Constructed Facilities, Nov2006, Vol. 20 Issue 4,
p336-348, 13p, 2 charts, 14 diagrams, 5 graphs
Stability of the World Trade Center Twin Towers Structural Frame in
Multiple Floor Fires. By: Usmani, A. S.. Journal of Engineering
Mechanics, Jun2005, Vol. 131 Issue 6, p654-657, 4p
Monahan, Bernard. Practice Periodical on Structural Design &
Construction, Aug2002, Vol. 7 Issue 3, p134, 2p
Hansen, Brett. Civil Engineering (08857024), Sep2007, Vol. 77 Issue 9,
p22-25, 3p;
Progressive Collapse of Structures: Annotated Bibliography and
Comparison of Codes and Standards. By: Mohamed, Osama A.. Journal of
Performance of Constructed Facilities, Nov2006, Vol. 20 Issue 4,
p418-425, 8p
I have about 30 more if you need to do an ounce of real research.
Sorry, I didn't list any from journals limited to CTists and are not
allowed to be peer-reviewed by outside experts. I just stick to
established professional journals and true peer-review.
http://www.civil.northwestern.edu/people/bazant/PDFs/Papers/405.pdf
http://web.archive.org/web/20011031095744/http://www.tam.uiuc.edu/news/200109wtc/
http://web.archive.org/web/20011031095744/http://www.tam.uiuc.edu/news/200109wtc/
The ASCE Pentagon Building Performance Report (PDF)
NIST Answers to Frequently Asked Questions About the WTC 1&2 Collapses - August, 2006
New - NIST Answers to Frequently Asked Questions - Supplement - December, 2007
NIST Final Reports on WTC 1 & 2
NIST NCSTAR 1: Federal Building and Fire Safety Investigation of the World Trade Center Disaster: Final Report of the National Construction Safety Team on the Collapses of the World Trade Center Towers
NCSTAR 1-1 Design, Construction, and Maintenance of Structural and Life Safety Systems
NCSTAR 1-2 Baseline Structural Performance and Aircraft Impact Damage Analysis of the WTC Towers
NCSTAR 1-3 Mechanical and Metallurgical Analysis of Structural Steel
NCSTAR 1-4 Active Fire Protection Systems
NCSTAR 1-5 Reconstruction of the Fires in the World Trade Center Towers
NCSTAR 1-6 Structural Fire Response and Probable Collapse Sequence of the World Trade Center Towers
NCSTAR 1-7 Occupant Behavior, Egress, and Emergency Communication
NCSTAR 1-8 The Emergency Response Operations
Investigations leading to alternate tower collapse hypotheses, and
critiques of NIST's WTC investigation by knowledgeable people who are
not conspiracy theorists: FEMA/ASCE, Arup Fire, University of
Edinburgh, Usmani, Torero, Lane, Cherepanov, Quintiere, Corbett,
Mackey, Greening
Peer-reviewed papers and conference papers about the WTC impacts, fires, and collapses
WTC collapse papers with Zdenek Bazant as lead author
May, 2007: Collapse of the World Trade Center Towers: What caused it and what didn't Co-authors Le, Greening & Benson. Refutation of controlled demolition theory. Discusses matching of video record with progressive collapse equations, "free-fall" claims, concrete crushing (and how much TNT equivalent would be needed to do that crushing), air pressure & ejection of air, spread of dust cloud.
June, 2006: Mechanics of Progressive Collapse: Learning from World Trade Center and Building Demolitions Co-author Verdure. PDF.
Excerpt (applies to link above and below): The kinetic energy of the top part of the tower impacting the floor below was found to be about 8.4x larger than the plastic energy absorption capability of the underlying story, and considerably higher than that if fracturing were taken into account (Bazant and Zhou 2002a). This fact, along with the fact that during the progressive collapse of underlying stories the loss of gravitational potential per story is much greater than the energy dissipated per story, was sufficient for Bazant and Zhou (2002a) to conclude, purely on energy grounds, that the tower was doomed once the top part of the tower dropped through the height of one story (or even 0.5 m).
Bazant & Zhou, 2001-2002: Why Did the World Trade Center Collapse?-Simple Analysis
Other explanations of the tower collapses
November, 2007: Structural Engineer Keith Seffen'smathematical model of WTC tower progressive collapse (PDF. Due to appear in the Journal of Engineering Mechanics, Vol. 134, No. 2, February 2008)
BBC News article about Seffen's paper
Dr. Frank Greening's papers on the Collapses, Energy Transfer, "Tipping," Concrete Pulverization (PDFs)
Physicist Manuel Garcia's Counterpunch articles on the physics of the WTC collapses Pt.1- Pt.2- Pt.3
Why didn't the towers, or the upper portions of them, topple over?
Why didn't the upper part pivot about it's base? See Bazant & Zhou (2001) Appendix II
Eduardo Kausel (MIT): Why the Towers didn't fall like trees
Frank Greening: An analysis of the tipping of the upper section of WTC 2 (PDF)
A simple graphic explanation of why the top of the south tower didn't fall to the side.
Physicist Dave Rogers on tipping of tower tops.
Structural engineer "Newton's Bit" on "tipping"
Explanations of NIST's Investigation Methods
See also: Investigations leading to alternate collapse hypotheses.
NIST's Investigation of the Sept. 11 World Trade Center Disaster: FAQ (2002: Goals & Methods)
Ryan Mackey on how the NIST investigation works, and on "Scholars" critics
Ryan Mackey on NIST's degree of certainty, bounding cases, comparisons to other studies
Ryan Mackey on NIST altering model inputs
Ryan Mackey on NIST recovered steel and fire models
JREF Ktesibios on NIST workstation actual tests
JREF RWGuinn on testing models to failure
Ryan Mackey on NIST fuel load estimates
Physicist Dave Rogers on scaling issues with physical models of large structures
NIST's Recommendations, and the Architectural and Engineering Community's Response
NIST summary of WTC 1 & 2 investigation results & recommendations (PDF)
The AIA's Response to NIST's Draft Report and Recommendations (PDF)
The World Trade Center Collapse and its Implications for International Standards - W. Gene Corley ISO Focus, January 2004 (PDF)
"Reexamining Premises for High-Rise Design" Security Management magazine (PDF)
In this article from Security Management magazine, Dr. Gene Corley discusses lessons from the World Trade Center investigation and how they might affect future building design.
NIBS Building Code Experts: Translating WTC Recommendations into Model Building Codes
First Comprehensive Set of Model Code Changes Adopted Based on Recommendations from Commerce's NIST World Trade Center Investigation (June, 2007)
Twin Towers' Structural Engineers on the Record
Excellent New Yorker Profile of WTC chief engineer Leslie Robertson, early speculation about collapses, many quotes from engineers, info about skyscraper design
Leslie Robertson on WTC steel core
No Tower Can Withstand Attack As Jets Get Bigger, Expert Says (Les Robertson $ NYT March 14, 2002)
"Reflections on the World Trade Center" (Robertson. PDF)
Jon Magnusson of Skilling Ward, helped design towers: "Engineers couldn't have known"
Gene Corley on FEMA/ASCE investigation lessons
"What We Learned: Building Performance Study of the WTC Collapse" (PDF) Outlines preliminary lessons learned in the FEMA/ASCE investigation of the NY World Trade Center collapse.
"Corley, ASCE Take Part in House Hearing" (PDF) On March 6, CTLGroup senior vice president Dr. Gene Corley testified before the Committee on Science of the U.S. House of Representatives. Dr. Corley was one of several members of the ASCE structural investigation team who were asked to discuss the performance of the World Trade Center in the September 11th attacks, and its implications for future building design. An article on the hearing from ASCE News.
"Looking Back on 9/11" (PDF) In this interview, Dr. Gene Corley discusses engineers' roles in the World Trade Center Building Performance Study
Abolhassan Astaneh-Asl's WTC collapse investigations
Tower Wreckage Reveals Clues - Astaneh - Jersey City Scrap Yards (later, some of these conclusions proved wrong)
Abolhassan Astaneh-Asl WTC Collapse, Field Investigations, and Analysis (Dec. 2003)
Now, as the five-year anniversary of the World Trade Center attack draws near, Astaneh-Asl finally expects to have the results of his analysis published in an academic journal. The project, requiring thousands of hours to complete, was self-funded and conducted by Astaneh-Asl, his students, and analysts from the MSC.Software Corporation, which donated the structural analysis software (MD Nastran and Dytran). Did the Building Do it? (Astaneh Study)
Testimony of Abolhassan Astaneh-Asl Before the House Committee on Science, March, 2002
Investigations involving extensive computer modeling of the towers
April, 2007: Purdue University analysis of WTC 1 collapse using LS-Dyna**More on the Purdue WTC study
"Did the Building Do It?" (Article about Abolhassan Astaneh-Asl/Cal FEA study, Sept, 2006)
Now, as the five-year anniversary of the World Trade Center attack draws near, Astaneh-Asl finally expects to have the results of his analysis published in an academic journal. The project, requiring thousands of hours to complete, was self-funded and conducted by Astaneh-Asl, his students, and analysts from the MSC.Software Corporation, which donated the structural analysis software (MD Nastran and Dytran).
NIST's SAP reference models of WTC 1&2, obtained through FOIA request
LU Xinzheng & JIANG Jianjing Simulation for the Collapse of WTC after Aeroplane Impact. Proceedings of the International Conference on the Protection of Structures Against Hazards, Nov. 2002. 57~60
Weidlinger Report Ties WTC Collapses to Column Failures (Matthys Levy). 10/25/02
The engineering team is comprised of: Weidlinger Associates Inc., led by Matthys Levy and Najib Abboud; LZA Technology/Thornton-Tomasetti Group, led by Daniel Cuoco and Gary Panariello; ARUPFire, led by Richard Custer; Hughes Associates Inc., led by Craig Beyler; SafirRosetti, led by Howard Safir; Hillman Environmental Group, led by Christopher Hillmann and John B. Glass Jr.; RWDI, led by Peter Irwin; Dr. W. Gene Corley, who led the ASCE-FEMA study; Professor Sean Ahearn; and Z-Axis Corp., led by Gary Freed and Alan Treibitz.
Weidlinger Study - Column failures
Weidlinger study refutes FEMA. Collapse inevitable due to structural damage and fires, not to WTC design defects. (NYT Oct 22, 2002)
First Tower to Fall Was hit at Higher Speed, Study Finds (NYT February 23, 2002)
Silverstein Sending Tower Data to U.S. Agency (NIST/Weidlinger/Insurance Agencies NYT Oct 1, 2002)
Even though the exterior columns all looked identical, both the grade and thickness of their steel varied from place to place, said Dr. Fahim Sadek, a researcher at the institute's building and fire research lab, who is producing a detailed structural model of the towers on a computer using the original blueprints. So there were actually more than 130 different column types, he said, each having to be accounted for in his model. From there, it gets only more intricate. One of Dr. Sadek's detailed models for a single floor -- the 96th floor of the north tower, considered typical -- contains 40,000 separate elements. A coarser representation of the entire tower contains 90,000 elements.
Swiss Re/Exponent Failure Analysis Associates WTC engineering study, Oct. 2002 (Complete copies of the FaAA study are available at Swiss Re by calling 212-317-5663.)
Ming Wang, Peter Chang, James Quintiere, and Andre Marshall "Scale Modeling of the 96th Floor of World Trade Center Tower 1" Journal of Performance of Constructed Facilities Volume 21, Issue 6, pp. 414-421 http://forums.randi.org/showthread.php?p=3161860#post3161860
Applied Reseach Associates NIST World Trade Center Investigations
Aircraft Impact Analysis of the World Trade Center Towers (Univ. of Tsukuba)
Jay Windley's (Jay Utah of BAUT forum) excellent explanation of Finite Element Analysis
Structure Magazine: Computer Modeling of the Collapse of the World Trade Center Towers (March, 2007)
CAD Digest article with CAD graphics (September, 2001) G. Charles Clifton
NIST's SAP reference models of WTC 1&2, obtained through FOIA request
More on WTC engineering, articles by and about engineers
who worked on the buildings and on the investigations
STRUCTURAL ENGINEERS AT GROUND ZERO - NCSEA (August Domel, Nov. 2001)
The Days After, the Days Ahead: Civil engineers respond to 9/11 Attacks (Civil Engineering, Nov. 2001)
Structural engineers first in the aftermath
Civil Engineering Magazine: Dissecting the Collapses
* Editorial: Engineering and Homeland Defense by George Bugliarello
* World Trade Center "Bathtub": From Genesis to Armageddon by George J. Tamaro The engineer who oversaw the construction of the World Trade Center "bathtub" describes the recovery efforts.
* A 911 Call to the Engineering Profession by Robert Prieto The events of September 11 challenged the future of our heavily engineered environment and the future of the engineering profession.
Early Structural Investigation Teams (through 5/02)
ASCE WTC Disaster Response Team
Engineer Tim Schenck on early GZ work
Multidisciplinary Center for Earthquake Engineering Research (MCEER) The World Trade Center Terrorist Attack: Damage to Critical Facilities and Crisis Response
Georgia Tech Engineering Team Will Conduct Post-Disaster Assessment at World Trade Center Attack Site
Architecture Week: Engineers Explain Collapses (5/2002)
Towers Lost and Beyond: 8 Articles by MIT researchers 2001-2002.
Civil Engineer: WTC & Pentagon Links Portal
Blog: Civil & structural engineers on WTC collapse
Forum on Technical Implications of WTC Collapses (Columbia U., November, 2001)
MIT Masters Thesis: WTC Disaster Analysis & Recommendations (June, 2005)
Designing tall buildings to Resist Earthquakes ($ NYT 2002)
Institute of Structural Engineers: Safety in tall buildings and other buildings of large occupancy ($ 2002)
9/17/01 Inferno Heat, Not Impact, Brought Down Towers, Experts Say
9/19/01: Space.com "Gravity Helped Destroy Twin Towers" concrete too heavy for core construction, walls seen buckling, seismic data
Others write about sensibly about the collapses
JREF Nobby Nobbs: Some basics on the physics of the collapses
Bautforum: Jay Utah's excellent explanation of Finite Element Analysis
JREF R. Mackey on Gordon Ross / Frank Greening debate
JREF R.Mackey on freefall and energy available for deformation
JREF R. Mackey on Judy Wood's "Math"
JREF Arkan on tower collapse times
JREF Myriad on kinetic energy of initial collapses
JREF rwguinn on structural steel deformation
JREF Dr. Adequate on Steven Jones' "handwaving" argument.
Physics kinetic energy Moscatelli The destructive forces unleashed
Steven Jones to Jim Fetzer: grand piano speed, damage to bathtub Judy Wood
JREF Kookbreaker on pancake collapse history
Ryan Mackey on independent validations of the NIST report.
Roberts: Were the towers as strong as they were designed to be?
JREF rwguinn: The engineers in my office thought the towers would collapse
More about the NIST & FEMA investigations
In Collapsing Towers, a Cascade of Failures ($ NYT Nov. 11, 2001)
Experts Urging Broader Inquiry In Towers' Fall (NYT Glanz, steel removal, Dec 25, 2001)
NIST to take over collapse investigation ($ NYT January 17, 2002)
Critique of FEMA WTC report by Ed Schulte in Plumbing Engineer, July, 2005 (PDF)
Learning from 9/11 (March, 2002) Hearing before the House Committee on Science: ASCE/FEMA BPAT study
Mismanagement Muddled Collapse Inquiry, House Panel Says (FEMA/NYC gov't/Fed gov't. $ NYT March 7, 2002)
At one point, Representative Anthony D. Weiner, a Democrat from New York City, asked for the official in charge to raise his hand, and two men, and then three appeared to do so. ''We have very serious problems here,'' added Representative John B. Larson, a Connecticut Democrat.
The lack of clear authority has had unfortunate consequences, the House members said. The Giuliani administration started to send World Trade Center steel off to recycling yards before investigators could examine it to determine whether it might hold crucial clues as to why the buildings fell.
The full investigative team set up by FEMA was not allowed to enter ground zero to collect other potentially critical evidence in the weeks after the attack, and it did not get a copy of the World Trade Center blueprints until early January, a delay House members found infuriating.
'The delay in the receipt of the plans did somewhat hinder the team's ability to confirm their understanding of the buildings,'' said Dr. W. Gene Corley, a structural engineer leading the investigative committee organized by FEMA.
A Port Authority spokesman defended the agency, saying that building plans had been given to federal officials within a week of the attack and that the agency was cooperating fully with the inquiry.
The federal officials who testified yesterday -- Dr. Arden L. Bement Jr., the director of the National Institute of Standards and Technology, and Robert F. Shea, the acting administrator of the Federal Emergency Management Agency's Insurance and Mitigation Administration -- repeatedly nodded their agreement.
In response to criticism from one committee member, Mr. Shea said, ''Frankly, I agree with you. There are many things in hindsight we would have done differently.''
The problem, they said, was the lack of clear authority in federal law and financing. None of the investigators, for example, had subpoena power, meaning that they could not order the city to stop sending the steel off for recycling or demand a copy of the building blueprints.
Government Orders Inquiry Into Trade Center Collapse ($ NYT March 23, 2002)
The Trade Center; Towers Fell as Intense Fire Beat Defenses, Report Says (FEMA. $ NYT March 29, 2002)
Interviews will examine why trade center collapsed -100,000 workers issued security passes
Wider Inquiry Into Towers Is Proposed ($ NYT May 2, 2002)
"In Data Trove, a Graphic Look at Towers' Fall, ($ NYT October 29, 2002)
Twin Tower Collapse Theory Challenged (Feb. 2003)
NIST Minutes of December 2-3, 2003, Meeting
New Evidence Is Reported That Floors Failed on 9/11 ($ NYT Dec. 3, 2003)
S. Shyam Sunder, who is leading the investigation for the National Institute of Standards and Technology in the Commerce Department, said, ''We are seeing evidence of floors appearing to be sagging -- or that had been damaged -- prior to collapse.'' Still, Dr. Sunder said, ''The relative role of the floors and the columns still remain to be determined in the collapse.''
NIST Not Ruling Anything Out on WTC Probe
Reliving 9/11, With Fire as Teacher (Modeling. $ NYT, Jan. 6, 2004)
NIST Public Briefing 05/05/04
Fire Testing Is Questioned In Findings On Towers (Current testing standards for new buildings inadequate. $ NYT August 26, 2004)
WTC Twin Tower Construction Details Pertinent to Engineering Investigations
See also WTC Construction, Systems, Power and WTC Core Construction
Gregory Urich: Detailed Estimate of Mass and Potential Energy of World Trade Center Tower (pdf)
WTC 1 & 2 core column data
Report of WTC fire code compliance--1993 (pdf)
Some Progressive Collapse Studies & Recommendations
Thanks to JREF forum member cmcaulif for his contributions
Progressive Collapse Basics (R. Shankar Nair. 2004 North American Steel Construction Conference. PDF)
Fire Induced Progressive Collapse. (Arup. PDF) "This paper considers issues related to fire induced progressive collapse of tall buildings in extreme events."
Fire induced progressive collapse analysis of high rise buildings
NISTIR 7396 "Best Practices for Reducing the Potential for Progressive Collapse in Buildings," February 2007
Above report based on NIST/SEI workshops. Workshop presentation materials are here.
Abolhassan Astaneh-Asl: Progressive collapse prevention in new and existing buildings (Includes use of catenary action of cables to resist collapse. 2003. pdf).
Practical Means for Energy-Based Analyses of Disproportionate Collapse Potential
Journal of Performance of Constructed Facilities, Volume 20, Issue 4, pp. 336-348 (November 2006)
Progressive Analysis Procedure for Progressive Collapse
Journal of Performance of Constructed Facilities, Volume 18, Issue 2, pp. 79-85 (May 2004)
Progressive Collapse of Structures: Annotated Bibliography and Comparison of Codes and Standards
Journal of Performance of Constructed Facilities, Volume 20, Issue 4, pp. 418-425 (November 2006)
Some Engineering & physics fundamentals & calculation aids
Efunda: Engineering Fundamentals
Online scientific calculator and unit converter
Shear Force And Bending diagrams 1
Ductile fracture and fragmentation in the reconstruction of the World Trade Center Attack (Wierzbicki)
Elastic Bending Theory
JREF: PixyMIsa on truther misuse of the term "entropy"
JREF Structural Engineer Newtons Bit on DCR/dead/live loads/safety factor
Steel: Ultimate strength vs. yield strength (strength is in the geometry)
A demonstration of kinetic energy: 7 grams of plastic vs. cast aluminum block
Main 9/11 Links Page
Fire Safety Engineering & the Performance of Structural Steel in Fires
Main 9/11 Links Page
See also Investigations leading to alternate tower collapse hypotheses, and critiques of NIST's
WTC investigation by knowledgeable people who are not conspiracy theorists
A few examples of structural steel failing in building fires
Large multistory steel-framed factory buildings quickly collapse due to fire Go
Unprotected steel fails in Madrid's Windsor Building fire, concrete core stands. Go
Collapse mechanism of the Madrid Windsor Building Go
BBC Report: Windsor building fire Go
Unprotected steel truss roof quickly fails in fire at McCormick Place, Chicago Go
Fire damage to protected steel in One Meridian Plaza, Philadelphia Go
Noises in steel buildings during fire equals danger! Go
JREF, Unfit4Command: Examples of steel destroyed by fire Go
Steel fails in paper factory fire Go
A building fire and structural failure (Steel buildings collapse due to fire) Go
Loss of fireproofing on steel leads to collapse (PDF) Go
NIST and FEMA Experiments, Studies, and Reports
NCSTAR 1-1 Design, Construction, and Maintenance of Structural and Life Safety Systems
NCSTAR 1-4 Active Fire Protection Systems
NCSTAR 1-5 Reconstruction of the Fires in the World Trade Center Towers
NCSTAR 1-6 Structural Fire Response and Probable Collapse Sequence of the World Trade Center Towers
NCSTAR 1-7 Occupant Behavior, Egress, and Emergency Communication
NCSTAR 1-8 The Emergency Response Operations
FEMA 403 Appendix A: Overview of Fire Protection in Buildings (pdf) Go
NIST: Fire Protection of Structural Steel in High-Rise buildings (white paper) Go
Underwriters Labs post-9/11 WTC fire testing, ASTM E119 standard Go
NIST early WTC fire simulation experiments and photos Go
Report of WTC fire code compliance--1993 (pdf Released via nistreview.org FOIA request) Go
NIST's Safety of Threatened Buildings Research Projects
NIST: 2-D Analysis of a Building Frame Under Gravity Load and Fire.
Fire Protection Engineering: "The future of fire simulation at NIST" (PDF)
NIST Gallery of WTC Fire Experiment #6
NIST project 6 structural fire response & collapse analysis
NIST Collected Publications Related to the Use of Elevators During Fires
Fire Protection Engineering Magazine on Computer Modeling / NIST
NIST fire tests: steel residential floor assemblies last 4 mins.
Similar test to above: steel lasts 4.5 minutes, wood, 9 minutes.
Some comments on Fire Testing and Modeling in the NIST WTC 1&2 report
FIRE CHIEFS REPORT ON 9/11 COMMISSION REPORT
Ryan Mackey on NIST recovered steel and fire models Go
JREF Ktesbios on NIST workstation actual tests Go
JREF RWGuinn on testing models to failure Go
Ryan Mackey on NIST fuel load estimates Go
Building Code Changes and Recommendations Resulting from WTC Collapses
Sally Regenhard Calls for New High-Rise Codes and Code Group Composition (Fire Engineering Mag. 4/02)
Engineering News-Record: Skyscrapers' Supporters Infuriated By Fire Fearmongers (response to Regenhard & SyscraperSafety.org)
SWEEPING CHANGES PUSHED FOR CODE ON CITY HIGH-RISES (NYT Aug 2, 2002)
City Reshaping Building Codes To U.S. Model (NYT May 17, 2004)
9/11 Has Spurred Only Modest Changes in New York City and National Building Codes (NYT 9/9/06)
First Comprehensive Set of Model Code Changes Adopted Based on Recommendations from Commerce's NIST World Trade Center Investigation (June, 2007)
NYC Building Code - Fire Protection
UK reached same NIST conclusions 3 years earlier: ARUP, New Civil Engineer Plus Go
NYC Dept. of Buildings WTC Task Force recommendations report Go
NIST summary of WTC 1 & 2 investigation results & recommendations (PDF)
The AIA's Response to NIST's Draft Report and Recommendations (PDF)
The World Trade Center Collapse and its Implications for International Standards - W. Gene Corley ISO Focus, January 2004 (PDF)
"Reexamining Premises for High-Rise Design" Security Management magazine (PDF)
In this article from Security Management magazine, Dr. Gene Corley discusses lessons from the World Trade Center investigation and how they might affect future building design.
NIBS Building Code Experts: Translating WTC Recommendations into Model Building Codes
TOWERS' COLLAPSE RAISES NEW DOUBTS ABOUT FIRE TESTS (NYT April 8, 2002)
''If I say, 'That product passed the test,' you as John Q. Public may be happy,'' said Dr. James G. Quintiere, a professor in fire protection engineering at the University of Maryland. ''But if we say, 'It passed the test, but we don't know how it will function in your house,' you would not be happy.''
TOWERS UNTESTED FOR MAJOR FIRE, INQUIRY SUGGESTS (NYT May 8, 2003)
Federal investigators studying the collapse of the twin towers on Sept. 11, 2001, say they now believe that the Port Authority of New York and New Jersey, the government agency that built the towers, never performed the fundamental tests needed to determine how their innovative structures would perform in a fire
Papers and articles about fire vs. structural steel, specific to the WTC
The behavior of lightweight composite floor trusses in fire Go
Did the Ban on Asbestos Lead to Loss of Life? (Guy Tozzoli, 707, PA discontinued asbestos use before required to do so. $ NYT 9/18/01)
Asbestos Use in the Construction of the World Trade Center
Faulty Fireproofing Is Reviewed as Factor in Trade Center Collapse (Frederick Mowrer, Alan REiss, Roger Morse. $ NYT Dec 13, 2001)
Comparing 2 Sets Of Twin Towers; Malaysian Buildings Offered as Model (Charles Thornton on Petronas Towers / High-strength concrete / Robertson / Nordenson NYT Oct. 23, 2002)
Some interesting thoughts on WTC fire protection, steel vs. concrete, redundancy, new materials Go
Charles H. Thornton, a structural engineer who is co-chairman of the Thornton-Tomasetti Group and also a member of the investigation's advisory committee, said the work would go a long way toward putting the field on a par with research on weaponry and space travel, which also require precise calculation of the effects of heat and blast on structures. ''It's never been done before in the building industry,'' said Mr. Thornton, who collaborated in the design of the Petronas Towers in Kuala Lumpur, Malaysia, currently the world's tallest structures. Especially puzzling is that the analysis of hazards posed by earthquakes and high winds has far outstripped similar work on fires. But just as earthquake engineering lurched forward after the major California quakes of 1971, 1989 and 1994, fire science is advancing after the events of Sept. 11, 2001. Reliving 9/11, With Fire as Teacher (NYT Jan 6, 2004)
Role of Fire Resistance Issues in the Collapse of the Twin Towers (PDF. Institute for Research in Construction, Canada)
Papers and articles about fire vs. structural steel, not specific to the WTC
Restrained fire resistance ratings in structural steel buildings Go
Structural Fire Engineering: Database: Cardington Fire Test Data Go
JREF: Dave_46 on the Cardington Lab Tests
Determination of fire induced collapse mechanisms of multi-story steel framed structures Go
A New Approach to Multi-Storey Steel Framed Buildings Fire and Steel Construction.
Rein et all, Multi-Story Fire Analysis for High Rise Buildings, 11th Interflam, London, September 2007
Performance of unprotected steel and composite steel frames exposed to fire (Master's Thesis) Go
Effect of Support Conditions on Steel Beams Exposed of Fire (Master's Thesis) Go
Fire safety engineering forum (numerous papers) Go
Recent advances in fire-structure analysis. Fire Safety Journal, In Press, Corrected Proof, Available online 20 August 2007, Dat Duthinh, Kevin McGrattan and Abed Khaskia
Coupled fire dynamics and thermal response of complex building structures. Proceedings of the Combustion Institute, Volume 30, Issue 2, January 2005, Pages 2255-2262 Kuldeep Prasad and Howard R. Baum
"Cabling in commercial buildings is frequently in close proximity to structural steel beams - which can lose structural integrity at fire temperatures as low as 800 degrees centigrade. Combustible cabling can burn at temperatures as high as 1,000 degrees centigrade - sufficient to cause the collapse of tall buildings under certain conditions.
The average ten-story commercial building with 100 office workstations per floor can contain more than 1 million feet of combustible "exception" cabling in concealed spaces; equivalent to the fuel load of 1,500 gallons of gasoline." http://www.cablefireresearch.org/cabling/risk.asp
Skyscraper fire protection in practice after 9/11, innovations, proposals
The discipline of structural fire protection after 9/11 Go
Arup: Innovative Structural Engineering for Tall builings in Fire (2005, PDF) Go
Arup Fire - Fire engineers present latest tall building structural response in severe fire studies (2005) Go
Structural fire engineering: Free advice from structural fire group in Manchester University. Go
Fire and Structures: The Implications of the World Trade Center (PDF) Go
Scientific American: New Thinking to Make Skyscrapers Safer Go
A Midtown Skyscraper Quietly Adds Armor (Citigroup Center NYT Aug 15, 2002)
Report Sees Lower Towers That Can Empty Faster (NYT March 28, 2002)
9/11 Prompts New Caution In Design of U.S. Skyscrapers (300 Mad., NYT Bldg, AOL Time Warner. NYT Sept. 9, 2002)
Structural Fire Engineering, World Trade Center Incident (9-11) & Fire Serviceability Limit States
Interact Fire Solutions--Passive Fire Protection using cast epoxy intumescent
Scientific American: New thinking to make skyscrapers safer
Interesting approach to protecting steel using fluid in channels
Cables hold promise in protecting existing buildings from bombs, researchers find
ARCHITECTURE; High Anxiety (Freedom Tower. NYT March 14, 2004)
The Fire Next Time: Skyscraper safety: the push for NY's high-rises to learn not to burn (VV July 5, 2005)
Increasing use of concrete in skyscrapers.
Astaneh recommends concrete shear walls
Lloyd's commissions study: King Concrete - 08 December 2001 - New Scientist
Concrete: Changing Uses Post-9/11 (New York Construction News May, 2003)
Public Issues and the World Trade Center Disaster (Masonry Contractors Association)
Features of the new WTC 7
Video: New WTC 7: safety and structural features
Fire engineering history, general publications
Dr. James Quintiere presentation on the history of fire science, fire science & education (PDF)
Eurocode: Introduction to Structural Fire Engineering (Powerpoint presentation) Go
Fire Engineering archives (subscription) and FDNY Chief Hayden podcasts (free)
Structural Fire Engineering One Stop Shop
Publications of the Fire Safety Association
Book: Collapse of Burning Buildings : A Guide to Fireground Safety - Vincent Dunn Go
Links to several fire studies from Peter, an architect with experience in designing high-rises
Publications of the University of Sheffield Fire Engineering Research Program Go
Arup Fire on Tall Buildings and the Events of 9/11 Go
Determination of Fire Induced Collapse Mechanisms of Multi-Storey Steel Framed Structures Go
Miscellaneous related links
AIA Building Security Through Design
Where does black smoke come from? (dark vs. light smoke explanation)
Oil rig destroyed in two hours by fire.
Elevator shaft smoke explosion Boston Go
Physicist Manuel Garcia Jr.: The Thermodynamics of 9/11 Go
Chris Marrion of ARUP USA Go
Book: Why Buildings Fall Down (great for the layman)
Main 9/11 Links Page
--
Al Dykes
News is something someone wants to suppress, everything else is advertising.
- Lord Northcliffe, publisher of the Daily Mail

[Ah man]

Post by t***@gmail.com

Post by Midex

Post by Al Dykes

Post by f***@gmail.com

Post by s***@gmail.com
In this article we show that "top-down" controlled demolition
accurately accounts for the collapse times of the World Trade Center
towers.

So what? =A0A collapsing building falls at 9.8 meters/second^2, whatever
causes it to collapse.
The towers collapsed because the fire weakened the steel framing,
causing the top floors to buckle. =A0Once the collapse started, it
overwhelmed the support structure below it.
-jcr

What I find interesting in the forensic engineering sense is that the
tower that was hit last fell first.
Aside from the different angles of entry, which could affect the time
to failure, the tower hit 2nd was also hit much lower, meaning there
was about twice the stresses on it.

The second tower was hit much lower and so had much more weight above
the floors that were weakened by fire and impact damage.

Thats correct Al Dykes. And then the unsupported floors above decided
to fall directly down into the greatest resistance rather than toppled
over the edge.

How exactly would flat slab floors have "toppled over the edge", eh
retard?

Post by Midex
Tell me, when you let go of a standing bicycle, does it collapse into
itself? Hey fuckwit moron? Or does it fall over side-ways?

It falls over sideways because 1) it's still structurally intact, and
2) the ground it underneath it, fuckwit

Post by Midex
Go and try it with a bicycle fuckwit moron.

Only a moron like you woulkd equate a bicycle with the WTC

So "morons" are now people educated in the sciences and engineering?

Unlike yourself, having only an Arts degree (as you claim but can't
verify), I probably can't appreciate the static physics invoked by
such an analogy on path of least resistance and centre of gravity.

According to your beloved theory Textor, every supporting column of
the Twin Towers and WTC7 failed at exactly the same time,
consecutively downward, just like a controlled demolition BUT it
wasn't a controlled demolition - no rather it was the new Allah Magic
Fire.

[t***@gmail.com]

Post by Ah man

Post by t***@gmail.com

Post by Midex

Post by Al Dykes

Post by f***@gmail.com

Post by s***@gmail.com
In this article we show that "top-down" controlled demolition
accurately accounts for the collapse times of the World Trade Center
towers.

So what? =A0A collapsing building falls at 9.8 meters/second^2, whatever
causes it to collapse.
The towers collapsed because the fire weakened the steel framing,
causing the top floors to buckle. =A0Once the collapse started, it
overwhelmed the support structure below it.
-jcr

What I find interesting in the forensic engineering sense is that the
tower that was hit last fell first.
Aside from the different angles of entry, which could affect the time
to failure, the tower hit 2nd was also hit much lower, meaning there
was about twice the stresses on it.

The second tower was hit much lower and so had much more weight above
the floors that were weakened by fire and impact damage.

Thats correct Al Dykes. And then the unsupported floors above decided
to fall directly down into the greatest resistance rather than toppled
over the edge.

How exactly would flat slab floors have "toppled over the edge", eh
retard?

Post by Midex
Tell me, when you let go of a standing bicycle, does it collapse into
itself? Hey fuckwit moron? Or does it fall over side-ways?

It falls over sideways because 1) it's still structurally intact, and
2) the ground it underneath it, fuckwit

Post by Midex
Go and try it with a bicycle fuckwit moron.

Only a moron like you woulkd equate a bicycle with the WTC

So "morons" are now people educated in the sciences and engineering?

No, just conspiracy retards like you

Post by Ah man
Unlike yourself, having only an Arts degree (as you claim but can't
verify)

Strange Jake, I can answer any question you like about my degree, but
you've never been able to answer any about your (non-existent)
degrees.

Post by Ah man
, I probably can't appreciate the static physics invoked by
such an analogy on path of least resistance and centre of gravity.
According to your beloved theory Textor, every supporting column of
the Twin Towers and WTC7 failed at exactly the same time,

LOL, do you actually know how the WTC was constructed, retard?

Post by Ah man
consecutively downward,

They were flat slab floors, supported at the rim, retard.

Post by Ah man
just like a controlled demolition BUT it
wasn't a controlled demolition - no rather it was the new Allah Magic
Fire.

Riiight jakey. It was your magic explosives: the ones nobody noticed
being planted, the ones there are no evidence for, and the ones nobody
- anywhere - has spilled the beans on.

Go buy yourself another tinfoil hat kook. No wonder the police
described you as having a serious mental illness.

PS. No "revolution" yet.

[Al Dykes]

Post by Ah man

Post by t***@gmail.com

Post by Midex

Post by Al Dykes

Post by f***@gmail.com

Post by s***@gmail.com
In this article we show that "top-down" controlled demolition
accurately accounts for the collapse times of the World Trade Center
towers.

So what? =A0A collapsing building falls at 9.8 meters/second^2, whatever
causes it to collapse.
The towers collapsed because the fire weakened the steel framing,
causing the top floors to buckle. =A0Once the collapse started, it
overwhelmed the support structure below it.
-jcr

What I find interesting in the forensic engineering sense is that the
tower that was hit last fell first.
Aside from the different angles of entry, which could affect the time
to failure, the tower hit 2nd was also hit much lower, meaning there
was about twice the stresses on it.

The second tower was hit much lower and so had much more weight above
the floors that were weakened by fire and impact damage.

Thats correct Al Dykes. And then the unsupported floors above decided
to fall directly down into the greatest resistance rather than toppled
over the edge.

How exactly would flat slab floors have "toppled over the edge", eh
retard?

Post by Midex
Tell me, when you let go of a standing bicycle, does it collapse into
itself? Hey fuckwit moron? Or does it fall over side-ways?

It falls over sideways because 1) it's still structurally intact, and
2) the ground it underneath it, fuckwit

Post by Midex
Go and try it with a bicycle fuckwit moron.

Only a moron like you woulkd equate a bicycle with the WTC

So "morons" are now people educated in the sciences and engineering?
Unlike yourself, having only an Arts degree (as you claim but can't
verify), I probably can't appreciate the static physics invoked by
such an analogy on path of least resistance and centre of gravity.
According to your beloved theory Textor, every supporting column of
the Twin Towers and WTC7 failed at exactly the same time,
consecutively downward, just like a controlled demolition BUT it
wasn't a controlled demolition - no rather it was the new Allah Magic
Fire.

Ah man <***@gmail.com> never heard of cascading failure which
describes the way any complex object comes apart under stress.

This is from a1983 paper published by the ACSE (American Society of
Civil Engineers)

Progressive collapse is a situation in which a localized failure in
a structure, caused by an abnormal load, TRIGGERS A CASCADE OF
FAILURE AFFECTING a major portion of the structure. Several
buildings have collapsed in this fashion in recent years, and the
possibility of progressive collapse is a source of continuing
concern. Several alternative methods to deal with the problem of
design for the prevention of progressive collapse are reviewed. A
computer analysis program capable of tracing the behavior of framed
structures through collapse is explained. Of particular note is the
capability to remove selectively any member in the structure and
determine if collapse will result. Several examples using
interactive computer graphics techniques in applying the collapse
resistant design procedures are presented.

http://cedb.asce.org/cgi/WWWdisplay.cgi?8300111


I suspect that Ah man <***@gmail.com> is bullshitting us.
His alleged expertise in chemistry hasn't taught him anything relevant
to civil engineering.

[Ah man]

Post by t***@gmail.com

Post by Midex

Post by Al Dykes

Post by f***@gmail.com

Post by s***@gmail.com
In this article we show that "top-down" controlled demolition
accurately accounts for the collapse times of the World Trade Center
towers.

So what? =A0A collapsing building falls at 9.8 meters/second^2, whatever
causes it to collapse.
The towers collapsed because the fire weakened the steel framing,
causing the top floors to buckle. =A0Once the collapse started, it
overwhelmed the support structure below it.
-jcr

What I find interesting in the forensic engineering sense is that the
tower that was hit last fell first.
Aside from the different angles of entry, which could affect the time
to failure, the tower hit 2nd was also hit much lower, meaning there
was about twice the stresses on it.

The second tower was hit much lower and so had much more weight above
the floors that were weakened by fire and impact damage.

Thats correct Al Dykes. And then the unsupported floors above decided
to fall directly down into the greatest resistance rather than toppled
over the edge.

How exactly would flat slab floors have "toppled over the edge", eh
retard?

Post by Midex
Tell me, when you let go of a standing bicycle, does it collapse into
itself? Hey fuckwit moron? Or does it fall over side-ways?

It falls over sideways because 1) it's still structurally intact, and
2) the ground it underneath it, fuckwit

Post by Midex
Go and try it with a bicycle fuckwit moron.

Only a moron like you woulkd equate a bicycle with the WTC

So "morons" are now people educated in the sciences and engineering?

Unlike yourself, having only an Arts degree (as you claim but can't
verify), I probably can't appreciate the static physics invoked by
such an analogy on path of least resistance and centre of gravity.

According to your beloved theory Textor, every supporting column of
the Twin Towers and WTC7 failed at exactly the same time,
consecutively downward, just like a controlled demolition BUT it
wasn't a controlled demolition - no rather it was the new Allah Magic
Fire.

[Al Dykes]

Post by Ah man

Post by t***@gmail.com

Post by Midex

Post by Al Dykes

Post by f***@gmail.com

Post by s***@gmail.com
In this article we show that "top-down" controlled demolition
accurately accounts for the collapse times of the World Trade Center
towers.

So what? =A0A collapsing building falls at 9.8 meters/second^2, whatever
causes it to collapse.
The towers collapsed because the fire weakened the steel framing,
causing the top floors to buckle. =A0Once the collapse started, it
overwhelmed the support structure below it.
-jcr

What I find interesting in the forensic engineering sense is that the
tower that was hit last fell first.
Aside from the different angles of entry, which could affect the time
to failure, the tower hit 2nd was also hit much lower, meaning there
was about twice the stresses on it.

The second tower was hit much lower and so had much more weight above
the floors that were weakened by fire and impact damage.

Thats correct Al Dykes. And then the unsupported floors above decided
to fall directly down into the greatest resistance rather than toppled
over the edge.

How exactly would flat slab floors have "toppled over the edge", eh
retard?

Post by Midex
Tell me, when you let go of a standing bicycle, does it collapse into
itself? Hey fuckwit moron? Or does it fall over side-ways?

It falls over sideways because 1) it's still structurally intact, and
2) the ground it underneath it, fuckwit

Post by Midex
Go and try it with a bicycle fuckwit moron.

Only a moron like you woulkd equate a bicycle with the WTC

So "morons" are now people educated in the sciences and engineering?
Unlike yourself, having only an Arts degree (as you claim but can't
verify), I probably can't appreciate the static physics invoked by
such an analogy on path of least resistance and centre of gravity.
According to your beloved theory Textor, every supporting column of
the Twin Towers and WTC7 failed at exactly the same time,
consecutively downward, just like a controlled demolition BUT it
wasn't a controlled demolition - no rather it was the new Allah Magic
Fire.

It appears that you are ignorant of "cascading failure", a good
description of the way that anything comes apart under stress.

Progressive collapse is a situation in which a localized failure in
a structure, caused by an abnormal load, triggers a cascade of
failure affecting a major portion of the structure. Several
buildings have collapsed in this fashion in recent years, and the
possibility of progressive collapse is a source of continuing
concern. Several alternative methods to deal with the problem of
design for the prevention of progressive collapse are reviewed. A
computer analysis program capable of tracing the behavior of framed
structures through collapse is explained. Of particular note is the
capability to remove selectively any member in the structure and
determine if collapse will result. Several examples using
interactive computer graphics techniques in applying the collapse
resistant design procedures are presented.

John L. Gross, Member, ASCE, (Asst. Prof., Dept. of Civ.,
Environmental, and Architectural Engrg., Univ. of Colorado,
Boulder, Colo. 80309) and William McGuire, Fellow, ASCE, (Prof.,
School of Civ. and Environmental Engrg., Cornell Univ., Ithaca,
N.Y.)

Journal of Structural Engineering, Vol. 109, No. 1, January 1983, pp. 1-15
http://cedb.asce.org/cgi/WWWdisplay.cgi?8300111

[John C. Randolph]

Post by Midex
And then the unsupported floors above decided
to fall directly down into the greatest resistance rather than toppled
over the edge.

Let me ask you something, sunshine: where would you expect the energy
to move those floors sideways would come from?

Go take an introductory physics course.

-jcr

[Tex]

Post by Midex
And then the unsupported floors above decided
to fall directly down into the greatest resistance rather than toppled
over the edge.

Let me ask you something, sunshine: where would you expect the energy to
move those floors sideways would come from?
Go take an introductory physics course.

He has imaginary science degrees. Do they count?

[Sean Carroll]

Post by Tex

Post by John C. Randolph
Go take an introductory physics course.

He has imaginary science degrees. Do they count?

Only if you multiply them by their complex conjugates first.

[Al Dykes]

Post by Midex

Post by Al Dykes

Post by f***@gmail.com

Post by s***@gmail.com
In this article we show that "top-down" controlled demolition
accurately accounts for the collapse times of the World Trade Center
towers.

So what? =A0A collapsing building falls at 9.8 meters/second^2, whatever
causes it to collapse.
The towers collapsed because the fire weakened the steel framing,
causing the top floors to buckle. =A0Once the collapse started, it
overwhelmed the support structure below it.
-jcr

What I find interesting in the forensic engineering sense is that the
tower that was hit last fell first.
Aside from the different angles of entry, which could affect the time
to failure, the tower hit 2nd was also hit much lower, meaning there
was about twice the stresses on it.

The second tower was hit much lower and so had much more weight above
the floors that were weakened by fire and impact damage.

Thats correct Al Dykes. And then the unsupported floors above decided
to fall directly down into the greatest resistance rather than toppled
over the edge.

Yup. It's called center of mass , which never went to any side far
enough to do what you say. The WTC towers were 210 ft on a side and the
upper part wasn't much higher than it was wide.

So what? Nobody heard or saw man-made explosives explode in any way
consistent with man-made demolition.

[Midex]

Post by Al Dykes

Post by f***@gmail.com

Post by s***@gmail.com
In this article we show that "top-down" controlled demolition
accurately accounts for the collapse times of the World Trade Center
towers.

So what? =A0A collapsing building falls at 9.8 meters/second^2, whatever
causes it to collapse.
The towers collapsed because the fire weakened the steel framing,
causing the top floors to buckle. =A0Once the collapse started, it
overwhelmed the support structure below it.
-jcr

What I find interesting in the forensic engineering sense is that the
tower that was hit last fell first.
Aside from the different angles of entry, which could affect the time
to failure, the tower hit 2nd was also hit much lower, meaning there
was about twice the stresses on it.

The second tower was hit much lower and so had much more weight above
the floors that were weakened by fire and impact damage.

What about all the floors that were not weakened by impact or fire?
Like the 80 odd floors below?

Why don't you go and hang out with your Goy gimp in your cellar there
in Tel Aviv and prepare for war JEW BOY?

Post by Al Dykes
--
Al Dykes
News is something someone wants to suppress, everything else is advertising.
- Lord Northcliffe, publisher of the Daily Mail

[Eric B.]

<***@gmail.com> wrote in message news:362fa55a-024e-4928-9250-***@s13g2000prd.googlegroups.com...

Count me a tinfoil-hat wearer, but I think it's not impossible that
(some of) these Truther apparent idiots are false-flag black
propaganda intended to poison the well of 9/11 conspiracy theories in
general.

Not that I think elements of the present administration "knew" about
9/11 per se, but it wouldn't surprise me if key decision makers took a
calculated risk to allow the hijackers to do their hijack and produce
a little 80s-style hijack drama at some airport somewhere. . . that
would have been good for business.


I think you're right on the money. The whole troofer thing stinks of false
flag. If the US wanted an incident they would have simply assisted our
enemies (al qaeda in this case) by making sure they got the access and
suppies they needed, not hatched this retarded scheme with explosives and
airplanes as simply a diversion. If they were going to use explosives why
even bother with planes? Just have those clever terrorists take
responsibility for bombing the WTC like they did the first time (or did
they?).

Eric B.

[s***@gmail.com]

Post by f***@gmail.com
Count me a tinfoil-hat wearer, but I think it's not impossible that
(some of) these Truther apparent idiots are false-flag black
propaganda intended to poison the well of 9/11 conspiracy theories in
general.
Not that I think elements of the present administration "knew" about
9/11 per se, but it wouldn't surprise me if key decision makers took a
calculated risk to allow the hijackers to do their hijack and produce
a little 80s-style hijack drama at some airport somewhere. . . that
would have been good for business.
I think you're right on the money. The whole troofer thing stinks of false
flag. If the US wanted an incident they would have simply assisted our
enemies (al qaeda in this case) by making sure they got the access and
suppies they needed,

Don't you fucking get it you fucking moron? AL CIADA IS A FUCKING
TROOP OF ACTORS. They are not real you dumb fucking cunt. The
terrorists don't exist you dumb fucking dunce. THE ARABS WERE FRAMED
BY [......] <-- fill here, hoL0c4USt d3ni3r!!!!

Post by f***@gmail.com
not hatched this retarded scheme with explosives and
airplanes as simply a diversion. If they were going to use explosives why
even bother with planes? Just have those clever terrorists take
responsibility for bombing the WTC like they did the first time (or did
they?).
Eric B.

[John C. Randolph]

AL CIADA IS A FUCKING TROOP OF ACTORS.

Why would a troop of actors pick a name that would remind people of Al
Queda, the notorious terrorist organization headed by Osama Bin Laden?

Rather poor marketing choice, I must say.

-jcr

[Ah man]

Post by John C. Randolph

AL CIADA IS A FUCKING TROOP OF ACTORS.

Why would a troop of actors pick a name that would remind people of Al
Queda, the notorious terrorist organization headed by Osama Bin Laden?
Rather poor marketing choice, I must say.
-jcr

Before you post, go look at the evidence that 9/11 was a false-flag
operation.
www.ae911truth.org

[Steve Hix]

In article

Post by Ah man

Post by John C. Randolph

AL CIADA IS A FUCKING TROOP OF ACTORS.

Why would a troop of actors pick a name that would remind people of Al
Queda, the notorious terrorist organization headed by Osama Bin Laden?
Rather poor marketing choice, I must say.
-jcr

Before you post, go look at the evidence that 9/11 was a false-flag
operation.
www.ae911truth.org

Done.

Weak to non-existent, at least in this particular universe.

[Midex]

Post by Steve Hix
In article

Post by Ah man

Post by John C. Randolph

AL CIADA IS A FUCKING TROOP OF ACTORS.

Why would a troop of actors pick a name that would remind people of Al
Queda, the notorious terrorist organization headed by Osama Bin Laden?
Rather poor marketing choice, I must say.
-jcr

Before you post, go look at the evidence that 9/11 was a false-flag
operation.
www.ae911truth.org

Done.
Weak to non-existent, at least in this particular universe.

Yu only exhibit your bottomless falsehood. On the list of people
supporting NIST's report which Al Dykes kindly supplied above, there
are about 20 times more P.E. Engineers supporting ae911truth.org

So unless you yourself are a P.E. engineer then you are going to have
to accept the consensus, just as a Court of Law does. The fact that we
can't get congress or a supreme court to rule on this matter just
shows you how corrupt the country has become.

Mate, its only going to get worse. If you want to experience what a
country is like when it has lost its rule of law and swamped by
corruption and mafia, then go and live in Rio De Janeiro for a few
months like I just did. You DO NOT WANT your country to dive into
despotism my friend.

Oh, look what you have done. You've made a fool of everyone.
JET (2 of them on 9/11)

[Steve Hix]

In article

Post by f***@gmail.com

Post by s***@gmail.com
In this article we show that "top-down" controlled demolition
accurately accounts for the collapse times of the World Trade Center
towers.

So what?  A collapsing building falls at 9.8 meters/second^2, whatever
causes it to collapse.
The towers collapsed because the fire weakened the steel framing,
causing the top floors to buckle.  Once the collapse started, it
overwhelmed the support structure below it.
-jcr

What I find interesting in the forensic engineering sense is that the
tower that was hit last fell first.
Aside from the different angles of entry, which could affect the time
to failure, the tower hit 2nd was also hit much lower, meaning there
was about twice the stresses on it.
Count me a tinfoil-hat wearer, but I think it's not impossible that
(some of) these Truther apparent idiots are false-flag black
propaganda intended to poison the well of 9/11 conspiracy theories in
general.
Not that I think elements of the present administration "knew" about
9/11 per se, but it wouldn't surprise me if key decision makers took a
calculated risk to allow the hijackers to do their hijack and produce
a little 80s-style hijack drama at some airport somewhere. . . that
would have been good for business.

Riiiiiiiiiiiiiight. A little thing worth the Trillion$ hit the economy
took over the next couple of years.

[Midex]

Post by Steve Hix
In article

Post by f***@gmail.com

Post by John C. Randolph

Post by s***@gmail.com
In this article we show that "top-down" controlled demolition
accurately accounts for the collapse times of the World Trade Center
towers.

So what? A collapsing building falls at 9.8 meters/second^2, whatever
causes it to collapse.
The towers collapsed because the fire weakened the steel framing,
causing the top floors to buckle. Once the collapse started, it
overwhelmed the support structure below it.
-jcr

What I find interesting in the forensic engineering sense is that the
tower that was hit last fell first.
Aside from the different angles of entry, which could affect the time
to failure, the tower hit 2nd was also hit much lower, meaning there
was about twice the stresses on it.
Count me a tinfoil-hat wearer, but I think it's not impossible that
(some of) these Truther apparent idiots are false-flag black
propaganda intended to poison the well of 9/11 conspiracy theories in
general.
Not that I think elements of the present administration "knew" about
9/11 per se, but it wouldn't surprise me if key decision makers took a
calculated risk to allow the hijackers to do their hijack and produce
a little 80s-style hijack drama at some airport somewhere. . . that
would have been good for business.

Riiiiiiiiiiiiiight. A little thing worth the Trillion$ hit the economy
took over the next couple of years.

Who made on it? It was good for Israel. It was good for all your
Zionists in the US who knew it was planned and coming.

In the US 7 in 10 billionaires are Jews. And yet only 2 in 100
Americans are jews.
You do the math fuckface.

[t***@gmail.com]

Post by Midex

Post by Steve Hix
In article

Post by f***@gmail.com

Post by John C. Randolph

Post by s***@gmail.com
In this article we show that "top-down" controlled demolition
accurately accounts for the collapse times of the World Trade Center
towers.

So what? A collapsing building falls at 9.8 meters/second^2, whatever
causes it to collapse.
The towers collapsed because the fire weakened the steel framing,
causing the top floors to buckle. Once the collapse started, it
overwhelmed the support structure below it.
-jcr

What I find interesting in the forensic engineering sense is that the
tower that was hit last fell first.
Aside from the different angles of entry, which could affect the time
to failure, the tower hit 2nd was also hit much lower, meaning there
was about twice the stresses on it.
Count me a tinfoil-hat wearer, but I think it's not impossible that
(some of) these Truther apparent idiots are false-flag black
propaganda intended to poison the well of 9/11 conspiracy theories in
general.
Not that I think elements of the present administration "knew" about
9/11 per se, but it wouldn't surprise me if key decision makers took a
calculated risk to allow the hijackers to do their hijack and produce
a little 80s-style hijack drama at some airport somewhere. . . that
would have been good for business.

Riiiiiiiiiiiiiight. A little thing worth the Trillion$ hit the economy
took over the next couple of years.

Who made on it? It was good for Israel. It was good for all your
Zionists in the US who knew it was planned and coming.
In the US 7 in 10 billionaires are Jews. And yet only 2 in 100
Americans are jews.
You do the math fuckface.

..and this proves *what*, eh jakey?

[Ah man]

Post by t***@gmail.com

Post by Midex

Post by Steve Hix
In article

Post by f***@gmail.com

Post by John C. Randolph

Post by s***@gmail.com
In this article we show that "top-down" controlled demolition
accurately accounts for the collapse times of the World Trade Center
towers.

So what? A collapsing building falls at 9.8 meters/second^2, whatever
causes it to collapse.
The towers collapsed because the fire weakened the steel framing,
causing the top floors to buckle. Once the collapse started, it
overwhelmed the support structure below it.
-jcr

What I find interesting in the forensic engineering sense is that the
tower that was hit last fell first.
Aside from the different angles of entry, which could affect the time
to failure, the tower hit 2nd was also hit much lower, meaning there
was about twice the stresses on it.
Count me a tinfoil-hat wearer, but I think it's not impossible that
(some of) these Truther apparent idiots are false-flag black
propaganda intended to poison the well of 9/11 conspiracy theories in
general.
Not that I think elements of the present administration "knew" about
9/11 per se, but it wouldn't surprise me if key decision makers took a
calculated risk to allow the hijackers to do their hijack and produce
a little 80s-style hijack drama at some airport somewhere. . . that
would have been good for business.

Riiiiiiiiiiiiiight. A little thing worth the Trillion$ hit the economy
took over the next couple of years.

Who made on it? It was good for Israel. It was good for all your
Zionists in the US who knew it was planned and coming.
In the US 7 in 10 billionaires are Jews. And yet only 2 in 100
Americans are jews.
You do the math fuckface.

..and this proves *what*, eh jakey?

If you have to ask then there is little point explaining the obvious
to a lying Zionist troll like yourself. You love Israel so much, why
don't you fuck off and go and live there? We all know you're a traitor
of Australia.

Fuck off to Israel Jew Boy.

[t***@gmail.com]

Post by Ah man

Post by t***@gmail.com

Post by Midex

Post by Steve Hix
In article

Post by f***@gmail.com

Post by John C. Randolph

Post by s***@gmail.com
In this article we show that "top-down" controlled demolition
accurately accounts for the collapse times of the World Trade Center
towers.

So what? A collapsing building falls at 9.8 meters/second^2, whatever
causes it to collapse.
The towers collapsed because the fire weakened the steel framing,
causing the top floors to buckle. Once the collapse started, it
overwhelmed the support structure below it.
-jcr

What I find interesting in the forensic engineering sense is that the
tower that was hit last fell first.
Aside from the different angles of entry, which could affect the time
to failure, the tower hit 2nd was also hit much lower, meaning there
was about twice the stresses on it.
Count me a tinfoil-hat wearer, but I think it's not impossible that
(some of) these Truther apparent idiots are false-flag black
propaganda intended to poison the well of 9/11 conspiracy theories in
general.
Not that I think elements of the present administration "knew" about
9/11 per se, but it wouldn't surprise me if key decision makers took a
calculated risk to allow the hijackers to do their hijack and produce
a little 80s-style hijack drama at some airport somewhere. . . that
would have been good for business.

Riiiiiiiiiiiiiight. A little thing worth the Trillion$ hit the economy
took over the next couple of years.

Who made on it? It was good for Israel. It was good for all your
Zionists in the US who knew it was planned and coming.
In the US 7 in 10 billionaires are Jews. And yet only 2 in 100
Americans are jews.
You do the math fuckface.

..and this proves *what*, eh jakey?

If you have to ask then there is little point explaining the obvious
to a lying Zionist troll like yourself.

So, you can't answer the question then (as usual). Maybe placing a
"bicycle on a garbage can" would answer it. Bwehehe

Post by Ah man
You love Israel so much, why
don't you fuck off and go and live there?

Why would I want to, jakey?

Post by Ah man
We all know you're a traitor
of Australia.

So, what acts of treason have I committed?

BTW, aren't you a "Venezuelan" now? or was it "Brazillian"...or was it
"Ecuadorian"?

Post by Ah man
Fuck off to Israel Jew Boy.

I'm not Jewish jakey, and I have no interest in going to Israel.

[Ah man]

Post by t***@gmail.com

Post by Ah man

Post by t***@gmail.com

Post by Midex

Post by Steve Hix
In article

Post by f***@gmail.com

Post by John C. Randolph

Post by s***@gmail.com
In this article we show that "top-down" controlled demolition
accurately accounts for the collapse times of the World Trade Center
towers.

So what? A collapsing building falls at 9.8 meters/second^2, whatever
causes it to collapse.
The towers collapsed because the fire weakened the steel framing,
causing the top floors to buckle. Once the collapse started, it
overwhelmed the support structure below it.
-jcr

What I find interesting in the forensic engineering sense is that the
tower that was hit last fell first.
Aside from the different angles of entry, which could affect the time
to failure, the tower hit 2nd was also hit much lower, meaning there
was about twice the stresses on it.
Count me a tinfoil-hat wearer, but I think it's not impossible that
(some of) these Truther apparent idiots are false-flag black
propaganda intended to poison the well of 9/11 conspiracy theories in
general.
Not that I think elements of the present administration "knew" about
9/11 per se, but it wouldn't surprise me if key decision makers took a
calculated risk to allow the hijackers to do their hijack and produce
a little 80s-style hijack drama at some airport somewhere. . . that
would have been good for business.

Riiiiiiiiiiiiiight. A little thing worth the Trillion$ hit the economy
took over the next couple of years.

Who made on it? It was good for Israel. It was good for all your
Zionists in the US who knew it was planned and coming.
In the US 7 in 10 billionaires are Jews. And yet only 2 in 100
Americans are jews.
You do the math fuckface.

..and this proves *what*, eh jakey?

If you have to ask then there is little point explaining the obvious
to a lying Zionist troll like yourself.

So, you can't answer the question then (as usual). Maybe placing a
"bicycle on a garbage can" would answer it. Bwehehe

Explain to us using static physics argumentation why it isn't a valid
analogy of the path of least resistance law of falling objects?

The bicycle won't fall through the rubbish can will it? Why, Chris
Textor?

Chris Textor, you ARE aware that NIST has never even attempted to
explain how the tops crashed thorugh the rest of the building to the
ground? Their excuse was more or less "It happened. Therefore it
happened"

Post by t***@gmail.com

Post by Ah man
You love Israel so much, why
don't you fuck off and go and live there?

Why would I want to, jakey?

Post by Ah man
We all know you're a traitor
of Australia.

So, what acts of treason have I committed?
BTW, aren't you a "Venezuelan" now? or was it "Brazillian"...or was it
"Ecuadorian"?

Post by Ah man
Fuck off to Israel Jew Boy.

I'm not Jewish jakey, and I have no interest in going to Israel.

[t***@gmail.com]

Post by Ah man

Post by t***@gmail.com

Post by Ah man

Post by t***@gmail.com

Post by Midex

Post by Steve Hix
In article

Post by f***@gmail.com

Post by John C. Randolph

Post by s***@gmail.com
In this article we show that "top-down" controlled demolition
accurately accounts for the collapse times of the World Trade Center
towers.

So what? A collapsing building falls at 9.8 meters/second^2, whatever
causes it to collapse.
The towers collapsed because the fire weakened the steel framing,
causing the top floors to buckle. Once the collapse started, it
overwhelmed the support structure below it.
-jcr

What I find interesting in the forensic engineering sense is that the
tower that was hit last fell first.
Aside from the different angles of entry, which could affect the time
to failure, the tower hit 2nd was also hit much lower, meaning there
was about twice the stresses on it.
Count me a tinfoil-hat wearer, but I think it's not impossible that
(some of) these Truther apparent idiots are false-flag black
propaganda intended to poison the well of 9/11 conspiracy theories in
general.
Not that I think elements of the present administration "knew" about
9/11 per se, but it wouldn't surprise me if key decision makers took a
calculated risk to allow the hijackers to do their hijack and produce
a little 80s-style hijack drama at some airport somewhere. . . that
would have been good for business.

Riiiiiiiiiiiiiight. A little thing worth the Trillion$ hit the economy
took over the next couple of years.

Who made on it? It was good for Israel. It was good for all your
Zionists in the US who knew it was planned and coming.
In the US 7 in 10 billionaires are Jews. And yet only 2 in 100
Americans are jews.
You do the math fuckface.

..and this proves *what*, eh jakey?

If you have to ask then there is little point explaining the obvious
to a lying Zionist troll like yourself.

So, you can't answer the question then (as usual). Maybe placing a
"bicycle on a garbage can" would answer it. Bwehehe

Explain to us using static physics argumentation why it isn't a valid
analogy of the path of least resistance law of falling objects?

Go learn how the WTC was constructed first, fuckwit

Post by Ah man
The bicycle won't fall through the rubbish can will it? Why, Chris
Textor?

No it won't Jakey. Too bad for you the WTC wasn't made of bicycles and
garbage cans.

Post by Ah man
Chris Textor, you ARE aware that NIST has never even attempted to
explain how the tops crashed thorugh the rest of the building to the
ground? Their excuse was more or less "It happened. Therefore it
happened"

It's been explained plenty of times, retard. Only conspiracy kooks
like you with imaginary degrees still wonder about it.

I'll give you a clue Jake: go and research how the WTC was constructed
(it doesn't have anything to the with "jews" either)

[Midex]

Post by t***@gmail.com

Post by Ah man

Post by t***@gmail.com

Post by Ah man

Post by t***@gmail.com

Post by Midex

Post by Steve Hix
In article

Post by f***@gmail.com

Post by John C. Randolph

Post by s***@gmail.com
In this article we show that "top-down" controlled demolition
accurately accounts for the collapse times of the World Trade Center
towers.

So what? A collapsing building falls at 9.8 meters/second^2, whatever
causes it to collapse.
The towers collapsed because the fire weakened the steel framing,
causing the top floors to buckle. Once the collapse started, it
overwhelmed the support structure below it.
-jcr

What I find interesting in the forensic engineering sense is that the
tower that was hit last fell first.
Aside from the different angles of entry, which could affect the time
to failure, the tower hit 2nd was also hit much lower, meaning there
was about twice the stresses on it.
Count me a tinfoil-hat wearer, but I think it's not impossible that
(some of) these Truther apparent idiots are false-flag black
propaganda intended to poison the well of 9/11 conspiracy theories in
general.
Not that I think elements of the present administration "knew" about
9/11 per se, but it wouldn't surprise me if key decision makers took a
calculated risk to allow the hijackers to do their hijack and produce
a little 80s-style hijack drama at some airport somewhere. . . that
would have been good for business.

Riiiiiiiiiiiiiight. A little thing worth the Trillion$ hit the economy
took over the next couple of years.

Who made on it? It was good for Israel. It was good for all your
Zionists in the US who knew it was planned and coming.
In the US 7 in 10 billionaires are Jews. And yet only 2 in 100
Americans are jews.
You do the math fuckface.

..and this proves *what*, eh jakey?

If you have to ask then there is little point explaining the obvious
to a lying Zionist troll like yourself.

So, you can't answer the question then (as usual). Maybe placing a
"bicycle on a garbage can" would answer it. Bwehehe

Explain to us using static physics argumentation why it isn't a valid
analogy of the path of least resistance law of falling objects?

Go learn how the WTC was constructed first, fuckwit

Yeh seen the blue-prints Textor.

But you've just got an Arts degree you claimed. So what the fuck has
this debate got to do with you? You're just fogging up the thread with
your vincible ignorance.

Look Chris Textor,

In a court of law an engineer is required to have a P.E. to be
considered an expert witness. If we lined up the P.E. engineers who
publicly support the conclusion that explosives brought down the three
towers against those who support NIST's magic fire theory, then the
NIST report would be ruled fraudulent as their engineers would be out
numbered about 20 to 1 and growing fast.

So as far as you are concerned, being a total layman as you are Chris
Textor, then you must accept the consensus.

I'm sorry that its been so difficult for you to understand tyranny. I
know you have made over 5000 posts inthe last 5 years attacking people
who dare not accept the official government jokes.
I would be very suprised in fact to learn that you are just a mentally
ill Troll. I'm pretty confident in fact you are a Gov Shill. Probably
a Jew too, as we all know Israel has everything to lose once the truth
is known about their little false-flag terrorist attack of 9/11.
www.iamthewitness.com

Post by t***@gmail.com

Post by Ah man
The bicycle won't fall through the rubbish can will it? Why, Chris
Textor?

No it won't Jakey. Too bad for you the WTC wasn't made of bicycles and
garbage cans.

Post by Ah man
Chris Textor, you ARE aware that NIST has never even attempted to
explain how the tops crashed thorugh the rest of the building to the
ground? Their excuse was more or less "It happened. Therefore it
happened"

It's been explained plenty of times, retard. Only conspiracy kooks
like you with imaginary degrees still wonder about it.
I'll give you a clue Jake: go and research how the WTC was constructed
(it doesn't have anything to the with "jews" either)

[John C. Randolph]

Post by Ah man
Explain to us using static physics argumentation why it isn't a valid
analogy of the path of least resistance law of falling objects?

There is no such law. As I suggested earlier, take a basic physics
course. The equation you're looking for is F=MA.

-jcr

[Ah man]

Post by t***@gmail.com

Post by Midex

Post by Steve Hix
In article

Post by f***@gmail.com

Post by John C. Randolph

Post by s***@gmail.com
In this article we show that "top-down" controlled demolition
accurately accounts for the collapse times of the World Trade Center
towers.

So what? A collapsing building falls at 9.8 meters/second^2, whatever
causes it to collapse.
The towers collapsed because the fire weakened the steel framing,
causing the top floors to buckle. Once the collapse started, it
overwhelmed the support structure below it.
-jcr

What I find interesting in the forensic engineering sense is that the
tower that was hit last fell first.
Aside from the different angles of entry, which could affect the time
to failure, the tower hit 2nd was also hit much lower, meaning there
was about twice the stresses on it.
Count me a tinfoil-hat wearer, but I think it's not impossible that
(some of) these Truther apparent idiots are false-flag black
propaganda intended to poison the well of 9/11 conspiracy theories in
general.
Not that I think elements of the present administration "knew" about
9/11 per se, but it wouldn't surprise me if key decision makers took a
calculated risk to allow the hijackers to do their hijack and produce
a little 80s-style hijack drama at some airport somewhere. . . that
would have been good for business.

Riiiiiiiiiiiiiight. A little thing worth the Trillion$ hit the economy
took over the next couple of years.

Who made on it? It was good for Israel. It was good for all your
Zionists in the US who knew it was planned and coming.
In the US 7 in 10 billionaires are Jews. And yet only 2 in 100
Americans are jews.
You do the math fuckface.

..and this proves *what*, eh jakey?

If you have to ask then there is little point explaining the obvious
to a lying Zionist troll like yourself. You love Israel so much, why
don't you fuck off and go and live there? We all know you're a traitor
of Australia.

Fuck off to Israel Jew Boy.

[Ah man]

Post by t***@gmail.com

Post by Midex

Post by Steve Hix
In article

Post by f***@gmail.com

Post by John C. Randolph

Post by s***@gmail.com
In this article we show that "top-down" controlled demolition
accurately accounts for the collapse times of the World Trade Center
towers.

So what? A collapsing building falls at 9.8 meters/second^2, whatever
causes it to collapse.
The towers collapsed because the fire weakened the steel framing,
causing the top floors to buckle. Once the collapse started, it
overwhelmed the support structure below it.
-jcr

What I find interesting in the forensic engineering sense is that the
tower that was hit last fell first.
Aside from the different angles of entry, which could affect the time
to failure, the tower hit 2nd was also hit much lower, meaning there
was about twice the stresses on it.
Count me a tinfoil-hat wearer, but I think it's not impossible that
(some of) these Truther apparent idiots are false-flag black
propaganda intended to poison the well of 9/11 conspiracy theories in
general.
Not that I think elements of the present administration "knew" about
9/11 per se, but it wouldn't surprise me if key decision makers took a
calculated risk to allow the hijackers to do their hijack and produce
a little 80s-style hijack drama at some airport somewhere. . . that
would have been good for business.

Riiiiiiiiiiiiiight. A little thing worth the Trillion$ hit the economy
took over the next couple of years.

Who made on it? It was good for Israel. It was good for all your
Zionists in the US who knew it was planned and coming.
In the US 7 in 10 billionaires are Jews. And yet only 2 in 100
Americans are jews.
You do the math fuckface.

..and this proves *what*, eh jakey?

If you have to ask then there is little point explaining the obvious
to a lying Zionist troll like yourself. You love Israel so much, why
don't you fuck off and go and live there? We all know you're a traitor
of Australia.

Fuck off to Israel Jew Boy.

[Ah man]

Post by t***@gmail.com

Post by Midex

Post by Steve Hix
In article

Post by f***@gmail.com

Post by John C. Randolph

Post by s***@gmail.com
In this article we show that "top-down" controlled demolition
accurately accounts for the collapse times of the World Trade Center
towers.

So what? A collapsing building falls at 9.8 meters/second^2, whatever
causes it to collapse.
The towers collapsed because the fire weakened the steel framing,
causing the top floors to buckle. Once the collapse started, it
overwhelmed the support structure below it.
-jcr

What I find interesting in the forensic engineering sense is that the
tower that was hit last fell first.
Aside from the different angles of entry, which could affect the time
to failure, the tower hit 2nd was also hit much lower, meaning there
was about twice the stresses on it.
Count me a tinfoil-hat wearer, but I think it's not impossible that
(some of) these Truther apparent idiots are false-flag black
propaganda intended to poison the well of 9/11 conspiracy theories in
general.
Not that I think elements of the present administration "knew" about
9/11 per se, but it wouldn't surprise me if key decision makers took a
calculated risk to allow the hijackers to do their hijack and produce
a little 80s-style hijack drama at some airport somewhere. . . that
would have been good for business.

Riiiiiiiiiiiiiight. A little thing worth the Trillion$ hit the economy
took over the next couple of years.

Who made on it? It was good for Israel. It was good for all your
Zionists in the US who knew it was planned and coming.
In the US 7 in 10 billionaires are Jews. And yet only 2 in 100
Americans are jews.
You do the math fuckface.

..and this proves *what*, eh jakey?

If you have to ask then there is little point explaining the obvious
to a lying Zionist troll like yourself. You love Israel so much, why
don't you fuck off and go and live there? We all know you're a traitor
of Australia.

Fuck off to Israel Jew Boy.

[John C. Randolph]

Post by Midex
Who made on it? It was good for Israel. It was good for all your
Zionists in the US who knew it was planned and coming.
In the US 7 in 10 billionaires are Jews. And yet only 2 in 100
Americans are jews.
You do the math fuckface.

..and another nazi exposes himself. FUCK YOU.

-jcr

[Midex]

Post by f***@gmail.com

Post by John C. Randolph

Post by s***@gmail.com
In this article we show that "top-down" controlled demolition
accurately accounts for the collapse times of the World Trade Center
towers.

So what? A collapsing building falls at 9.8 meters/second^2, whatever
causes it to collapse.
The towers collapsed because the fire weakened the steel framing,
causing the top floors to buckle. Once the collapse started, it
overwhelmed the support structure below it.
-jcr

What I find interesting in the forensic engineering sense is that the
tower that was hit last fell first.

It had more floors above the impact zone.

Look mate, it was a controlled demolition. You saw WTC7 come down by
now. You know that in 2006 a Zogby poll showed that some 60% of
Americans didn't even know a third building come down. WTC7 was the
same height as Edifcio Italia - the tallest building in South America.
Its no fucking trivia that this building collapsed. The reason that
the 60% Americans didn't know about the building is because the
mainstream media, owned by just 5 corporations, specifically refused
to play it. Actually, until 2007 FOX Network has NEVER played the
footage of WTC7.

Anyway. Here is the expert consensus now on the collapses:
www.ae911truth.org

Post by f***@gmail.com
Aside from the different angles of entry, which could affect the time
to failure, the tower hit 2nd was also hit much lower, meaning there
was about twice the stresses on it.
Count me a tinfoil-hat wearer, but I think it's not impossible that
(some of) these Truther apparent idiots are false-flag black
propaganda intended to poison the well of 9/11 conspiracy theories in
general.
Not that I think elements of the present administration "knew" about
9/11 per se, but it wouldn't surprise me if key decision makers took a
calculated risk to allow the hijackers to do their hijack and produce
a little 80s-style hijack drama at some airport somewhere. . . that
would have been good for business.

[John C. Randolph]

Post by Midex
Look mate, it was a controlled demolition.

No, it was not, and wishing won't make it one.

Post by Midex
You saw WTC7 come down by now.

As it happens, I used to work in World Trade 7. So did a whole lot of
other people. There's no way anyone could undertake the massive
engineering project of preparing a building for implosion without any
of the thousands of people who worked there noticing.

-jcr

[Tex]

Post by John C. Randolph

Post by Midex
Look mate, it was a controlled demolition.

No, it was not, and wishing won't make it one.

Post by Midex
You saw WTC7 come down by now.

As it happens, I used to work in World Trade 7. So did a whole lot of
other people. There's no way anyone could undertake the massive
engineering project of preparing a building for implosion without any of
the thousands of people who worked there noticing.

Jake watches Youtube 'documentaries'. Therefore, he knows more about it than
you....

[Docha Filoposo]

Post by John C. Randolph
The towers collapsed because the fire weakened the steel framing,
causing the top floors to buckle. Once the collapse started, it
overwhelmed the support structure below it.

Show me an individual that believes this and I'll show you an
individual that has not spent 1 hour looking at the facts and news
broadcasts about 9/11.

Also, Sibel Edmonds says that the number 3 man at the State Dept. got
several 9/11 suspects released from custody so they "would not spill
the beans". These suspects immediately left the country.

Ask your "government" (aka crime syndicate) why.

[Midex]

Post by Docha Filoposo

Post by John C. Randolph
The towers collapsed because the fire weakened the steel framing,
causing the top floors to buckle. Once the collapse started, it
overwhelmed the support structure below it.

Show me an individual that believes this and I'll show you an
individual that has not spent 1 hour looking at the facts and news
broadcasts about 9/11.
Also, Sibel Edmonds says that the number 3 man at the State Dept. got
several 9/11 suspects released from custody so they "would not spill
the beans". These suspects immediately left the country.
Ask your "government" (aka crime syndicate) why.

Docha, in Washington DC they refer to them as the JEWISH MAFIA.

[Midex]

Post by John C. Randolph

Post by s***@gmail.com
In this article we show that "top-down" controlled demolition
accurately accounts for the collapse times of the World Trade Center
towers.

So what? A collapsing building falls at 9.8 meters/second^2, whatever
causes it to collapse.
The towers collapsed because the fire weakened the steel framing,
causing the top floors to buckle. Once the collapse started, it
overwhelmed the support structure below it.

Bwahahahahahahah!!!!!!!! Go find me 20 engineers and architects who
are on public record supporting that NIST joke.
Here are 280 professional degreed engineers and architects on public
record warning you that it was a controlled demolition:
www.ae911truth.org
REMEMBER: These 280 degreed professionals have nothing to gain by
speaking out publicly on this matter. They have EVERYTHING to lose as
individuals - careers, jobs, friends.....They are saying that 9/11 was
a false-flag operation. They are accusing Bush and the Neocons, and
subsequently Zionist American dual Israeli citizens of plotting a
false-flag attack on the US state to get them to go and fight off more
of Israel's enemies in the middle-east.

Post by John C. Randolph
-jcr

[a***@yahoo.com]

Post by Midex

Post by s***@gmail.com
In this article we show that "top-down" controlled demolition
accurately accounts for the collapse times of the World Trade Center
towers.

So what?  A collapsing building falls at 9.8 meters/second^2, whatever
causes it to collapse.
The towers collapsed because the fire weakened the steel framing,
causing the top floors to buckle.  Once the collapse started, it
overwhelmed the support structure below it.

Bwahahahahahahah!!!!!!!! Go find me 20 engineers and architects who
are on public record supporting that NIST joke.
Here are 280 professional degreed engineers and architects on public
record warning you that it was a controlled demolition:www.ae911truth.org
REMEMBER: These 280 degreed professionals have nothing to gain by
speaking out publicly on this matter. They have EVERYTHING to lose as
individuals - careers, jobs, friends.....They are saying that 9/11 was
a false-flag operation. They are accusing Bush and the Neocons, and
subsequently Zionist American dual Israeli citizens of plotting a
false-flag attack on the US state to get them to go and fight off more
of Israel's enemies in the middle-east.

Nothing to gain? Except for being a bunch of anti-semitic pro-Arab-
terrorist assholes.

Degreed in what? Dog grooming?


Conspiracy theories about 9/11 implosions are impossibly assinine.
Consider:

1. Do these 9/11 IDIOTS have any idea how much EXPLOSIVES would have
been necessary to do this?

1a. WHO put these explosives in place?
1b. How come nobody SAW any of these explosives? They would have had
to have been plastered to the walls, etc. Holes would have had to have
been drilled, there would be detonator wires all over the place,
drywall would be smashed in.
1c. How come nobody SAW a team of workers bringing in TONS of
explosives into BOTH of the Twin Towers?
1d. Where would Bush have gotten such total traitors and murderers as
workers? This would certainly be repugnant to patriotic Americans of
the right wing.
1e. Why have there been no stool-pigeons? Virtually every one of
Bush's former cabinet members have turned into stool-pigeons informing
on Bush. Don't you think that some of these conspirators would have
stool-pigeoned by now?

2. WHY would Bush have even WANTED to do 9/11? It was certainly not
clear in advance that 9/11 would work to his political advantage. It
was actually a terrible stain upon his administration that 9/11
happened UNDER HIS WATCH. If the Democrats had any brains, they could
have CRUCIFIED him for it. 9/11 only "turned out" to be to Bush's
advantage. Consequently, there would not even be a motivation for it
to happen.

3. Finally, the amateur Saudi Arabian Al Quida pilots would have been
required to hit the buildings in PRECISELY the correct location to set
off all of these explosives.

4. There would have been chemical traces of explosives. Considering
that a huge amount of explosives would have been necessary, there
would have been chemical traces of them.

5. People would have seen explosives going off, if the building had
been imploded. There were no explosives. The top floors simply
collapsed of their own weight after steel supports had melted. That is
what caused the so-called "implosion". There were no explosions after
the initial impact of the airplanes.

There is ample documentation of the collapse of both buildings, and it
is clear that there were none of the explosions that you would have
seen if it had somehow been exploded.

To conclude, these are just a FEW of the arguments against the idiotic
9/11 conspiracy theories.

It is rather clear that certain people are just so desperate to deny
the REALITY of the need for the War on Terror, that they must makes up
fantasies to defy reality. The 9/11 conspiracy theories are as idiotic
as saying that Pearl Harbor never happened, or that the Holocaust
never happened.

[Midex]

Post by a***@yahoo.com

Post by Midex

Post by John C. Randolph

Post by s***@gmail.com
In this article we show that "top-down" controlled demolition
accurately accounts for the collapse times of the World Trade Center
towers.

So what? A collapsing building falls at 9.8 meters/second^2, whatever
causes it to collapse.
The towers collapsed because the fire weakened the steel framing,
causing the top floors to buckle. Once the collapse started, it
overwhelmed the support structure below it.

Bwahahahahahahah!!!!!!!! Go find me 20 engineers and architects who
are on public record supporting that NIST joke.
Here are 280 professional degreed engineers and architects on public
record warning you that it was a controlled demolition:www.ae911truth.org
REMEMBER: These 280 degreed professionals have nothing to gain by
speaking out publicly on this matter. They have EVERYTHING to lose as
individuals - careers, jobs, friends.....They are saying that 9/11 was
a false-flag operation. They are accusing Bush and the Neocons, and
subsequently Zionist American dual Israeli citizens of plotting a
false-flag attack on the US state to get them to go and fight off more
of Israel's enemies in the middle-east.

Nothing to gain? Except for being a bunch of anti-semitic pro-Arab-
terrorist assholes.
Degreed in what? Dog grooming?
Conspiracy theories about 9/11 implosions are impossibly assinine.
1. Do these 9/11 IDIOTS have any idea how much EXPLOSIVES would have
been necessary to do this?

Your question is patently ridiculous. In one aspect you are claiming
that it was fire alone, and then in the next you are claiming that an
extraordinary large quantity of explosives would be needed to achieve
what fire on a few floors alone is meant to have caused.

What a fucking classic example of cognitive dissonance you just
exhibited. You are the supreme fuckwit of moron sheeple I've ever
seen.

Go ask the 280 degreed professional architects and engineers who are
signatory to the conclusion that there is no explanation for the
collapses other than preplanted explosives.
www.ae911truth.org
Go find me just 20 of the same ilk who publicly support NIST's
ridiculous MAGIC FIRE explanation.

Post by a***@yahoo.com
1a. WHO put these explosives in place?

Good question. Thats why we need a truly independent international
criminal investigation.
I think it was a Mossad team. But we need an investigation to solicit
and supeana the evidence of WHO did it. We KNOW SOMEONE put explosives
in the three towers to bring them down.

Post by a***@yahoo.com
1b. How come nobody SAW any of these explosives?

hmmm. Lots of people disagree with you on that one mate. 100s of
witnesses. All of them turned back from the 9/11 COmmission and their
testimonies refused submission. Also the First Responders Oral
Testimonies were suppressed until August 2005 when a Court of Appeals
decision finally forced the authorities to publish them.

Post by a***@yahoo.com
They would have had
to have been plastered to the walls, etc. Holes would have had to have
been drilled, there would be detonator wires all over the place,
drywall would be smashed in.

According to the people who are qualified to comment on this, the
consensus is that only CD explosives could explain the collapses.
www.ae911truth.org
These 280 people have NO INTEREST in speaking out publicly. In fact,
they have everything to lose.

Post by a***@yahoo.com
1c. How come nobody SAW a team of workers bringing in TONS of
explosives into BOTH of the Twin Towers?

What kind of a fuckwit moron qustion is that? It was a false-flag
operation. Therefore NO ONE would see it happen. Therefore if you are
going to rig the buildings it has to be done by a mafia team and it
has to be done in such a way that no-one will notice.

Man, why am I even replying to a total fuckwit moron's question?

Post by a***@yahoo.com
1d. Where would Bush have gotten such total traitors and murderers as
workers? This would certainly be repugnant to patriotic Americans of
the right wing.

Bush knew it was a black-op. But as President his job is to be
ignorant of all those facts and just to play the MUSLIMS DID IT story.
For Bush and Co. the benefit was their Oil and War businesses. The
vice-president Dick Cheney is the former CEO of Haliburton - the
biggest profiteer of the Iraq and Afghan invasions.

Its not just a coincidence that Dick Cheney has these associations.
What do you think FUCKWIT SHEEPLE MORON?

Post by a***@yahoo.com
1e. Why have there been no stool-pigeons? Virtually every one of
Bush's former cabinet members have turned into stool-pigeons informing
on Bush. Don't you think that some of these conspirators would have
stool-pigeoned by now?

You understand what you are talking about? Do you understand the scale
of what you are talking about?

Post by a***@yahoo.com
2. WHY would Bush have even WANTED to do 9/11?

Bush's popularity sky-rocketed after 9/11. "9/11" has been the
sweetener of every neo-con's rhetoric for the entire Bush
administration.

But we would expect such dumb founded ignorant sheeple fuckwit moronic
questions from a guy like you.

Here is a tip: Look up "Bush Doctrine". Also go read the PNAC
September 2000 publication "Rebuilding America's Defences" - pay
particular attention to the paragraph containing the phrase "New Pearl
Harbour". Also pay notice to the authors and signatories. Also pay
notice that PNAC is the ZIONIST JEWISH thinktank no in control of Bush
Admin Foreign Policy.

Post by a***@yahoo.com
It was certainly not
clear in advance that 9/11 would work to his political advantage. It
was actually a terrible stain upon his administration that 9/11
happened UNDER HIS WATCH.

lol. Thats why his popularity sky-rocketed in the year after 9/11? Is
that why he won the 2004 election as well?

How come fuckwit moron sheeple like you bother typing anything? Are
you trying to sooth the cognitive dissonance of other sheeple?

Post by a***@yahoo.com
If the Democrats had any brains, they could
have CRUCIFIED him for it.

No such thing as Democrats and republicans in Washington today mate.
Both sides of the SAME COIN.

Post by a***@yahoo.com
9/11 only "turned out" to be to Bush's
advantage. Consequently, there would not even be a motivation for it
to happen.

Sure..............................................havn't read PNAC's
Rebulding America's Defences have you mate?

Post by a***@yahoo.com
3. Finally, the amateur Saudi Arabian Al Quida pilots would have been
required to hit the buildings in PRECISELY the correct location to set
off all of these explosives.

Ah, no, there were no muslim pilots. The pilots were JEWS and they
were sitting comfortably at home using smart-bomb missile guide
systems to direct the planes. The technology is and was ALL AVAILABLE.
Some of you FUCKWIT SHEEPLE MORONS try to make out that its an
outrageous sci-fi idea to point out that the planes could easily have
been remote-piloted. Don't anyone tell you that the patents and
technology for these "anti-hijacking" systems already existed. Irony
of anti-hijacking avionics is that they are actually used to HIJACK
the plane back off the HIJACKERS.

Did you know that immediately after 9/11 the Saud Royals accused
Zionists of carrying out the attacks?

Post by a***@yahoo.com
4. There would have been chemical traces of explosives. Considering
that a huge amount of explosives would have been necessary, there
would have been chemical traces of them.

There was. Matre, the EPA lied about the air quality at Ground Zero.
They were ordered by the White House to lie and say the air was safe.
We now know that the air was actually the most toxic in the world.
Today 10s of thousands of volunteers who helped at ground zero are
suffering fatal and debilitating diseases caused by the toxic dust air
at ground zero.

Post by a***@yahoo.com
5. People would have seen explosives going off,

they did. You can seen them for yourself on the videos of the
collapse. It is also worth noting (although a fuckwit like you
wouldn't) that the mainstream media avoided playing all of this
footage in all of their 9/11 revisitations and memorial documentaries.
For example, they would always show the plane hitting, but would never
show the full collapse footage. Also worth noting that as 9/11
happened every single LIVE commentator in the country was asking how
the fuck the terrorists got explosives into the buildings.

Post by a***@yahoo.com
if the building had
been imploded. There were no explosives. The top floors simply
collapsed of their own weight after steel supports had melted.

Oh now we know for sure you are totally in the dark about this hey
mate? Sorry for all the abuse. I thought you were just a regulsr gov
shill we have working the net. Look mate, go and burn that Pot Belly
Stove good and hot mate. Throw some Jet Fuel in there and let her rip.
See any steel melting?

Also mate, go and leave your aluminium pot on the gas stove all night.
Trust me, in the morning it will still be there - no molten
aluminium.

But don't let Year 10 physics get in your way mate - on 9/11 Open
Combustion Fires melted steel. On 9/11 Allah Almighty suspended the
laws of physics.

Post by a***@yahoo.com
That is
what caused the so-called "implosion". There were no explosions after
the initial impact of the airplanes.

Sure mate. We believe you.

Post by a***@yahoo.com
There is ample documentation of the collapse of both buildings, and it
is clear that there were none of the explosions that you would have
seen if it had somehow been exploded.

Go have a good read here: www.ae911truth.org

Do you know what you're doing mate? You are regurgitating to us the
very carefully designed BLATANT LIES of the Mainstream Media. Mate,
call me angry, but if I was permitted to, I could give you a list of
100 media anchors whom I would call to be executed for LYING.

Here are some quotes you won't hear ever repeated on the JEW
CONTROLLED media:

"The Central Intelligence Agency owns everyone of any significance in
the major media."
--William Colby, former CIA Director, quoted by Dave Mcgowan,
Derailing Democracy

"Our job is to give people not what they want, but what we decide they
ought to have."
-- Richard Salent, Former President CBS News.

"News is what someone wants to suppress. Everything else is
advertising".
former NBC news President Rubin Frank


"You could get a journalist cheaper than a good call girl, for a
couple hundred dollars a month."
--CIA operative, discussing the availability and prices of journalists
willing to peddle CIA propaganda and cover stories. Katherine the
Great, by Deborah Davis

"There is quite an incredible spread of relationships. You don't need
to manipulate Time magazine, for example, because there are [Central
Intelligence] Agency people at the management level."
--William B. Bader, former CIA intelligence officer, briefing members
of the Senate Intelligence Committee, The CIA and the Media, by Carl
Bernstein

"The Agency's relationship with [The New York] Times was by far its
most valuable among newspapers, according to CIA officials. [It was]
general Times policy ... to provide assistance to the CIA whenever
possible."
--The CIA and the Media, by Carl Bernstein

"Senator William Proxmire has pegged the number of employees of the
federal intelligence community at 148,000 ... though Proxmire's number
is itself a conservative one. The "intelligence community" is
officially defined as including only those organizations that are
members of the U.S. Intelligence Board (USIB); a dozen other agencies,
charged with both foreign and domestic intelligence chores, are not
encompassed by the term.... The number of intelligence workers
employed by the federal government is not 148,000, but some
undetermined multiple of that number."
--Jim Hougan, Spooks

"For some time I have been disturbed by the way the CIA has been
diverted from its original assignment. It has become an operational
and at times a policy-making arm of the government.... I never had any
thought that when I set up the CIA that it would be injected into
peacetime cloak and dagger operations."
--former President Harry Truman, in a letter to the Washington Post,
one month after the JFK assassination, December 21, 1963


==========
"Let me give you a word on the philosophy of reform. The whole history
of the progress of human liberty shows that all concessions yet made
to her august claims have been born of earnest struggle. The conflict
has been exciting, agitating, all absorbing, and for the time being
putting all other tumults into silence. It must do this or it does
nothing. If there is no struggle there is no progress. Those who
profess to favour freedom, and yet depreciate agitation, are men who
want crops without plowing up the ground. They want rain without
thunder and lightning. They want the ocean without the awful roar of
its many waters. This struggle may be a moral one; or it may be a
physical one; or it may be both moral and physical; but it must be a
struggle. Power concedes nothing without a demand. It never did and it
never will. Find out just what people will submit to, and you have
found the exact amount of injustice and wrong which will be imposed
upon them; and these will continue until they are resisted with either
words or blows, or with both. The limits of tyrants are prescribed by
the endurance of those whom they oppress. - Frederick Douglass -
Letter to an abolitionist associate, 1849. (Quoted in Howard Zinn - A
peoples history of the United States).

Post by a***@yahoo.com
To conclude, these are just a FEW of the arguments against the idiotic
9/11 conspiracy theories.

Basically you just expressed your absolute ignorance of FACTS. You
don't even know what went down before, on, and after 9/11.

You are one of those attackers who just want it to be simple: "Planes
hit towers. Towers came down. Those weird middle-eastern people did
it. Lets go kill them all."

Post by a***@yahoo.com
It is rather clear that certain people are just so desperate to deny
the REALITY of the need for the War on Terror, that they must makes up
fantasies to defy reality. The 9/11 conspiracy theories are as idiotic
as saying that Pearl Harbor never happened, or that the Holocaust
never happened.

Ah, no not really mate. Nobody is saying that the towers didn't come
down.

Go have a long think about this mate. When people talk about WW2 and
different events that went on, and they debate about what happened
here or there and how it happened and why it happened, do people jump
in and call them "WW2 deniers"?

The Jews have chosen to call their personal group-suffering during WW2
"The Holocaust". They can call it whatever they fucking want. But to
claim that there were gas-chambers at Auschwitz or that "6 million" of
them died, or that there was an Nazi Jewish Extermination Policy, well
they will continued to be exposed for the bottomless falsehood that is
well known of Jews.


Meanwhile, fuckwit sheeple morons like you can go and enjoy your thick-
shake from McDonald's and go and watch more JEW OWNED television and
be a good little Goy Slave.

[Snit]

Post by s***@gmail.com
WTC Towers: The Case For Controlled Demolition

Too late.

[Isa HardDik]

Post by s***@gmail.com
WTC Towers: The Case For Controlled Demolition
By Herman Schoenfeld
In this article we show that "top-down" controlled demolition
accurately accounts for the collapse times of the World Trade Center
towers.

Go fuck yourself needle dick.

[RichL]

This was posted about six months ago and thoroughly discredited then.
Repeating a lie over and over again doesn't make it true.

[Midex]

Post by RichL
This was posted about six months ago and thoroughly discredited then.
Repeating a lie over and over again doesn't make it true.

lol. "totally discredited then".
Here is the consensus from the experts:
www.ae911truth.org

The jury is in. It was a controlled demolition.

[t***@gmail.com]

Post by Midex

Post by RichL
This was posted about six months ago and thoroughly discredited then.
Repeating a lie over and over again doesn't make it true.

lol. "totally discredited then".
Here is the consensus from the experts:www.ae911truth.org
The jury is in. It was a controlled demolition.

Your group of kooks do not make a "consensus", idiot

[Ah man]

Post by t***@gmail.com

Post by Midex

Post by RichL
This was posted about six months ago and thoroughly discredited then.
Repeating a lie over and over again doesn't make it true.

lol. "totally discredited then".
Here is the consensus from the experts:www.ae911truth.org
The jury is in. It was a controlled demolition.

Your group of kooks do not make a "consensus", idiot

Qualified professional engineers and architects are "kooks" according
to Zionist troll loser Canberra resident, Chris Textor (aka Tex).


Still waiting for you to find me a comparable list of engineers and
architects who publicly support the NIST Magic Fire explanation.

I'll give you a $1000 if you can find me 20. You won't be able to
find even that many. I'd call 280 to 20 a fairly overwhelming expert
consensus.

[t***@gmail.com]

Post by Ah man

Post by t***@gmail.com

Post by Midex

Post by RichL
This was posted about six months ago and thoroughly discredited then.
Repeating a lie over and over again doesn't make it true.

lol. "totally discredited then".
Here is the consensus from the experts:www.ae911truth.org
The jury is in. It was a controlled demolition.

Your group of kooks do not make a "consensus", idiot

Qualified professional engineers and architects are "kooks" according
to Zionist troll loser Canberra resident, Chris Textor (aka Tex).

Well Jake, you're listed as one of their "qualified" experts, and your
only qualifications are in your mind, so you'll excuse me if I don't
take your kook group seriously.

Post by Ah man
Still waiting for you to find me a comparable list of engineers and
architects who publicly support the NIST Magic Fire explanation.

Why would they Jake? There's no reason for them to come out and
support and obvious truth.

Please find me 20 engineers who support the existence of corn flakes.
If you can't, they must not exist. Right Jakey?

Post by Ah man
I'll give you a $1000 if you can find me 20.

You don't have "$1000" Jakey. I've heard you can't even afford the
medication for your mental illness

Post by Ah man
You won't be able to
find even that many. I'd call 280 to 20 a fairly overwhelming expert
consensus.

No Jake, 280 across the entire planet isn't a "consensus", retard.

Now, go and take your medication. The police said you had a serious
mental illness. Isn't it about time you had it treated?

[Ah man]

Post by t***@gmail.com

Post by Ah man

Post by t***@gmail.com

Post by Midex

Post by RichL
This was posted about six months ago and thoroughly discredited then.
Repeating a lie over and over again doesn't make it true.

lol. "totally discredited then".
Here is the consensus from the experts:www.ae911truth.org
The jury is in. It was a controlled demolition.

Your group of kooks do not make a "consensus", idiot

Qualified professional engineers and architects are "kooks" according
to Zionist troll loser Canberra resident, Chris Textor (aka Tex).

Well Jake, you're listed as one of their "qualified" experts, and your
only qualifications are in your mind, so you'll excuse me if I don't
take your kook group seriously.

You have any evidence that ae911truth is fraudulently claiming to
verify degrees?

You have any evidence that I don't have a BSc from Melbourne
University?

Nope.

Post by t***@gmail.com

Post by Ah man
Still waiting for you to find me a comparable list of engineers and
architects who publicly support the NIST Magic Fire explanation.

Why would they Jake? There's no reason for them to come out and
support and obvious truth.
Please find me 20 engineers who support the existence of corn flakes.
If you can't, they must not exist. Right Jakey?

Post by Ah man
I'll give you a $1000 if you can find me 20.

You don't have "$1000" Jakey. I've heard you can't even afford the
medication for your mental illness

Post by Ah man
You won't be able to
find even that many. I'd call 280 to 20 a fairly overwhelming expert
consensus.

No Jake, 280 across the entire planet isn't a "consensus", retard.
Now, go and take your medication. The police said you had a serious
mental illness. Isn't it about time you had it treated?

[t***@gmail.com]

Post by Ah man

Post by t***@gmail.com

Post by Ah man

Post by t***@gmail.com

Post by Midex

Post by RichL
This was posted about six months ago and thoroughly discredited then.
Repeating a lie over and over again doesn't make it true.

lol. "totally discredited then".
Here is the consensus from the experts:www.ae911truth.org
The jury is in. It was a controlled demolition.

Your group of kooks do not make a "consensus", idiot

Qualified professional engineers and architects are "kooks" according
to Zionist troll loser Canberra resident, Chris Textor (aka Tex).

Well Jake, you're listed as one of their "qualified" experts, and your
only qualifications are in your mind, so you'll excuse me if I don't
take your kook group seriously.

You have any evidence that ae911truth is fraudulently claiming to
verify degrees?

Yep: you're on the list.

Post by Ah man
You have any evidence that I don't have a BSc from Melbourne
University?
Nope.

The fact you can't answer any questions about your "degrees". Why is
that Jakey?

[Ah man]

Post by t***@gmail.com

Post by Ah man

Post by t***@gmail.com

Post by Midex

Post by RichL
This was posted about six months ago and thoroughly discredited then.
Repeating a lie over and over again doesn't make it true.

lol. "totally discredited then".
Here is the consensus from the experts:www.ae911truth.org
The jury is in. It was a controlled demolition.

Your group of kooks do not make a "consensus", idiot

Qualified professional engineers and architects are "kooks" according
to Zionist troll loser Canberra resident, Chris Textor (aka Tex).

Well Jake, you're listed as one of their "qualified" experts, and your
only qualifications are in your mind, so you'll excuse me if I don't
take your kook group seriously.

Post by Ah man
Still waiting for you to find me a comparable list of engineers and
architects who publicly support the NIST Magic Fire explanation.

Why would they Jake? There's no reason for them to come out and
support and obvious truth.
Please find me 20 engineers who support the existence of corn flakes.
If you can't, they must not exist. Right Jakey?

Post by Ah man
I'll give you a $1000 if you can find me 20.

You don't have "$1000" Jakey. I've heard you can't even afford the
medication for your mental illness

Post by Ah man
You won't be able to
find even that many. I'd call 280 to 20 a fairly overwhelming expert
consensus.

No Jake, 280 across the entire planet isn't a "consensus", retard.

According to Chris Textor EVERY ENGINEER AND ARCHITECT in the world
has studied the collapses.

Notice Chris Textor can't find us a list of at least 20 engineers and
architects who support the NIST explanation? lol.

Post by t***@gmail.com
Now, go and take your medication. The police said you had a serious
mental illness. Isn't it about time you had it treated?

[t***@gmail.com]

Post by Ah man

Post by t***@gmail.com

Post by Ah man

Post by t***@gmail.com

Post by Midex

Post by RichL
This was posted about six months ago and thoroughly discredited then.
Repeating a lie over and over again doesn't make it true.

lol. "totally discredited then".
Here is the consensus from the experts:www.ae911truth.org
The jury is in. It was a controlled demolition.

Your group of kooks do not make a "consensus", idiot

Qualified professional engineers and architects are "kooks" according
to Zionist troll loser Canberra resident, Chris Textor (aka Tex).

Well Jake, you're listed as one of their "qualified" experts, and your
only qualifications are in your mind, so you'll excuse me if I don't
take your kook group seriously.

Post by Ah man
Still waiting for you to find me a comparable list of engineers and
architects who publicly support the NIST Magic Fire explanation.

Why would they Jake? There's no reason for them to come out and
support and obvious truth.
Please find me 20 engineers who support the existence of corn flakes.
If you can't, they must not exist. Right Jakey?

Post by Ah man
I'll give you a $1000 if you can find me 20.

You don't have "$1000" Jakey. I've heard you can't even afford the
medication for your mental illness

Post by Ah man
You won't be able to
find even that many. I'd call 280 to 20 a fairly overwhelming expert
consensus.

No Jake, 280 across the entire planet isn't a "consensus", retard.

According to Chris Textor EVERY ENGINEER AND ARCHITECT in the world
has studied the collapses.

Where did I say that jakey?

Post by Ah man
Notice Chris Textor can't find us a list of at least 20 engineers and
architects who support the NIST explanation? lol.

Notice Jake McCrann hasn't provided a list of 20 scientists who
support the existence of corn flakes?

Post by Ah man

Post by t***@gmail.com
Now, go and take your medication. The police said you had a serious
mental illness. Isn't it about time you had it treated?

No response to this, eh jakey?

[Al Dykes]

Post by Ah man

Post by t***@gmail.com

Post by Ah man

Post by t***@gmail.com

Post by Midex

Post by RichL
This was posted about six months ago and thoroughly discredited then.
Repeating a lie over and over again doesn't make it true.

lol. "totally discredited then".
Here is the consensus from the experts:www.ae911truth.org
The jury is in. It was a controlled demolition.

Your group of kooks do not make a "consensus", idiot

Qualified professional engineers and architects are "kooks" according
to Zionist troll loser Canberra resident, Chris Textor (aka Tex).

Well Jake, you're listed as one of their "qualified" experts, and your
only qualifications are in your mind, so you'll excuse me if I don't
take your kook group seriously.

Post by Ah man
Still waiting for you to find me a comparable list of engineers and
architects who publicly support the NIST Magic Fire explanation.

Why would they Jake? There's no reason for them to come out and
support and obvious truth.
Please find me 20 engineers who support the existence of corn flakes.
If you can't, they must not exist. Right Jakey?

Post by Ah man
I'll give you a $1000 if you can find me 20.

You don't have "$1000" Jakey. I've heard you can't even afford the
medication for your mental illness

Post by Ah man
You won't be able to
find even that many. I'd call 280 to 20 a fairly overwhelming expert
consensus.

No Jake, 280 across the entire planet isn't a "consensus", retard.

According to Chris Textor EVERY ENGINEER AND ARCHITECT in the world
has studied the collapses.
Notice Chris Textor can't find us a list of at least 20 engineers and
architects who support the NIST explanation? lol.

Abolhassan Astaneh-Asl, Ph.D., P.E.
Alan Rosa, P.E., S.E.
Allyn Kilsheimer, P.E.
Amit Bandyopadhyay, S.E.
Amy Zelson Mundorff
Anamaria Bonilla, S.E.
Andrew McConnell, S.E.
Andrew Mueller-Lust, S.E.
Andrew Pontecorvo, P.E.
Anthony Kirk US&R Structural Specialist
Anthony W. Chuliver, S.E.
Antoine E. Naaman, Ph.D.
Antranig M. Ouzoonian, P.E.
Arlan Dobson, FEMA Region 2 DAS
August Domel, Ph.D., S.E., P.E.
Bernie Denke US&R Structural Specialist
Bill Cote
Bill Coulbourne, P.E., S.E.
Bob Gray (I.U.O.E.)
Bonnie Manley, P.E., S.E.
Boris Hayda, P.E., S.E.
Brian Lyons, Tully
Brian McElhatten, S.E.
Brian Smith (Col.), Chief Deputy Medical Examiner, Dover AFB
Charles Hirsch, M.D.
Charles J. Carter, AISC
Charles Thornton, P.E.
Charlie Vitchers
Christopher E. Marrion, P.E.
Christopher M. Hewitt, AISC
Chuck Guardia, S.E.
D. Stanton Korista, P.E., S.E.
Dan Doyle (IW 40)
Dan Eschenasy, P.E., S.E.
Dan Koch Jr.
Daniel A. Cuoco, P.E
Daniele Veneziano, P.E.
David Davidowitz, ConEd
David Hoy, S.E.
David Leach, USACE
David M. Parks, ME
David Peraza, P.E., S.E.
David Ranlet
David Schomburg
David Sharp, S.E.
David T. Biggs, P.E.
Dean Koutsoubis, S.E.
Dean Tills, P.E.
Delbert Boring, P.E.
Dennis Clark (IST)
Dennis Dirkmaat, Ph.D.
Dennis Mileti, Ph.D.
Dennis Smith
Dick Posthauer, S.E.
Donald Friedman, P.E.
Donald O. Dusenberry, P.E.
Ed McGinley, P.E.
Ed Plaugher, Chief, Arlington FD
Edward A. Flynn, Arlington Police Chief
Edward Depaola, S.E.
Edward M. DePaola, P.E.
Edward Stinnette, Chief, FCFD
Fahim Sadek, P.E., S.E.
Farid Alfawakhiri Ph.D.
FDNY Battalion Chief Frank Vallebuono
FDNY Captain Anthony Varriale
FDNY Chief Frank Cruthers
FDNY Chief Frank Fellini
FDNY Chief Joseph Callan
FDNY Chief of Operations Daniel Nigro
FDNY Deputy Chief Nick Visconti
FDNY Deputy Chief Peter Hayden
FDNY Firefighter Sam Melisi
Francis J. Lombardi, P.E.
Frank Gayle, Sc.D.
Gary Keith, V.P. NFPA
Gary Steficek, S.E.
Gary Suson
Gary Tokle, Asst. VP, NFPA
George Tamaro, P.E., S.E.
Gerald Haynes, P.E.
Gerald Wellman US&R Structural Specialist
Guy Colonna, P.E., NFPA
Guylene Proulx, Ph.D.
H.S. Lew, P.E., S.E.
Hal Bidlack, Lt. Col. USAF (ret.), Ph.D.
Harold E. Nelson, P.E., FSFP.E.
Harry Martin, AISC
J. David Frost, Ph.D., P.E.
Jack Brown Deputy Chief Loudoun County (Va.) Fire Rescue Department
Jack Messagno, WTC project Manager (Tully)
James A. Rossberg, P.E.
James Chastain US&R Structural Specialist
James H. Fahey, S.E.
James Lord, FSFP.E.
James Milke, Ph.D., P.E.
Jan Szumanski, IUOE
Jason Averill, FSFP.E.
Jeffrey Hartman, S.E.
Jim Abadie, Bovis
Joel Meyerowitz
John Gross, Ph.D., P.E.
John Hodgens, FDNY (ret.)
John J. Zils, P.E., S.E.
John L. Gross, Ph.D., P.E.
John Lekstutis, P.E.
John M. Hanson, Ph.D, P.E.
John McArdle NYPD/ESU (DTC)
John Moran, NYPD/ESU (NTC)
John O'Connell
John Odermatt (NYC OEM)
John Ruddy, P.E., S.E.
John W. Fisher, P.E.
Jon Magnusson, P.E., S.E.
John Ryan, PAPD
Jonathan Barnett, Ph.D
Joo-Eun Lee P.E., S.E.
Joseph C. Gehlen, P.E., S.E.
Jozef Van Dyck, P.E.
Juan Paulo Morla, S.E.
Karl Koch III
Karl Koch IV
Kaspar Willam, P.E., S.E.
Kenneth Holden
Kent Watts
Kevin Brennan, OSHA
Kevin Malley, FDNY (ret.)
Kevin Terry, S.E.
Kurt Gustafson, P.E., S.E.
Larry Keating (IW 40)
Lawrence C. Bank, Ph.D., P.E.
Lawrence Griffis, P.E.
Leo J. Titus, P.E.
Leonard M. Joseph, P.E.
Leslie E. Robertson, P.E., S.E.
Long T. Phan, Ph.D., P.E.
Lou Mendes, P.E., S.E.
Louis Errichiello, S.E.
Manny Velivasakis, P.E.
Mark Blair
Mark Kucera, USACE
Mark Tamaro, P.E
Mark Volpe, IW 40
Marty Corcoran
Matthew G. Yerkey, P.E., S.E.
Merle E. Brander, P.E.
Mete A. Sozen, Ph.D., S.E.
Michael Burton, P.E.
Michael Dallal
Michael Hessheimer, S.E.
Michael Tylk, P.E., S.E.
Mike Banker, FDNY Capt. (SOC)
Mike Marscio, P.E.
Miroslav Sulc,, P.E., S.E.
Mohammed Ettouney
Morgan Hurley, FSFP.E.
Nestor Iwankiw, Ph.D., P.E.
Nick Carcich
Norman Groner, Ph.D.
Pablo Lopez, P.E., S.E.
Paul A. Bosela, Ph.D., P.E.
Paul F. Mlakar, Ph.D., P.E.
Paul Sledzik
Paul Tertell, P.E.
Pete Bakersky
Peter Chipchase, S.E.
Peter Rinaldi, P.E.
Pia Hoffman
Rajani Nair, S.E.
Ramon Gilsanz, P.E., S.E
Randy Lawson
Raul Maestre, P.E., S.E.
Raymond F. Messer, P.E.
Reidar Bjorhovde, Ph.D., P.E
Richard Bukowski P.E., FSFP.E.
Richard G. Gewain, P.E., S.E.
Richard Gann, Ph.D.
Richard Garlock, P.E., S.E.
Richard Kahler US&R Structural Specialist
Robert C. Sinn, P.E., S.E.
Robert F. Duval (NFPA)
Robert Frances US&R Structural Specialist
Robert J. McNamara, P.E., S.E.
Robert Ratay, Ph.D., P.E., S.E.
Robert Shaler, M.D.
Robert Smilowitz, Ph.D., P.E
Robert Solomon, P.E.
Robert Wills, AISC
Ronald Hamburger, P.E., S.E.
Ronald J. LaMere, P.E.
Ronald Rehm, Ph.D.
Ronald Spadafora, FDNY D.A.C
Ruben M. Zallen, P.E.
Russell "Rusty" Dodge Jr, Asst. Chief, Fort Belvoir FD
S. Shyam Sunder, P.E., S.E.
Saw-Teen See, P.E.
Shankar Nair. P.E., S.E.
Shawn Kelly, Arlington County Fire Marshal
Socrates Ioannides, P.E., S.E.
Sonny Scarff
Stan Murphy, P.E.
Stephen Cauffman
Steve Rasweiler, FDNY B.C. (SOC)
Stuart Foltz, P.E.
Terry Sullivan, Bovis
Theodore Galambos, P.E.
Theodore Krauthammer, Ph.D., P.E.
Therese P. McAllister, Ph.D., P.E.
Thomas Hawkins Jr, Chief, AFD
Thomas Schlafly, AISC
Todd Ude, P.E., S.E.
Tom Scarangello, P.E.
Tom Stanton (IST)
Tony Beale, P.E.
Valentine Junker
Venkatesh Kodur, Ph.D., P.E.
Victor Hare, P.E.
Vincent Dunn, FDNY (ret.)
W. Gene Corley, Ph.D., P.E., S.E.
W. Lee Evey
Wallace Miller
William Baker, P.E., S.E
William Grosshandler, Ph.D., ME
William McGuire, P.E.
Willie Quinlan, IW
Zdenek Bazant, Ph.D., S.E.

9/11 Commission & Staff
Thomas H. Kean, Chair
Lee H. Hamilton, Vice Chair
Richard Ben-Veniste
Fred F. Fielding
Jamie S. Gorelick
Slade Gorton
Bob Kerrey
John F. Lehman
Timothy J. Roemer
James R. Thompson

Joanne Accolla
Alexis Albion
Scott Allan
John Azzarello
Caroline Barnes
Warren Bass
Ann Bennett
Mark Bittinger
Madeleine Blot
Antwion Blount
Geoff Brown
Daniel Byman
Dianna Campagna
Sam Caspersen
Melissa Coffey
Lance Cole
Marquittia Coleman
Marco Cordero
Raj De Counsel
George Delgrosso
Gerald L. Dillingham
Thomas Dowling
Steven Dunne
Thomas Eldridge
John Farmer
Alvin Felzenberg
Gordon England
Lorry Fenner
Susan Ginsburg
T. Graham Giusti
Nicole Grandrimo
Doug Greenburg
Barbara Grewe
Elinore Hartz
Len Hawley
Christine Healey
Karen Heitkotter
Walt Hempel
Michael Hurley
Dana Hyde
Michael Jacobson
Bonnie Jenkins
Reginald Johnson
William Johnstone
Stephanie Kaplan
Miles Kara
Janice Kephart-Roberts
Hyon Kim
Christopher Kojm
Katarzyna (Kasia) Kozaczuk
Gordon Lederman
Daniel Leopold
Sarah Linden
Douglas MacEachin
Daniel Marcus
Ernest May
James Miller

[Ah man]

lol. In your below "list" it says:

"Investigations leading to alternate tower collapse hypotheses, and
critiques of NIST's WTC investigation by knowledgeable people who are
not conspiracy theorists: FEMA/ASCE, Arup Fire, University of
Edinburgh, Usmani, Torero, Lane, Cherepanov, Quintiere, Corbett,
Mackey, Greening"

See there listed Quintiere?

Lets have a look at what he had to say a few months ago at the World
Fire Safety Convention packed out by experts from around the world.
Quintiere is the former NIST Chief of Fire-Safety.

["I think the official conclusion that NIST arrived at is
questionable," explained Dr. Quintiere. "Let's look at real
alternatives that might have been the cause of the collapse of the
World Trade Towers and how that relates to the official cause and
what's the significance of one cause versus another."

Dr. Quintiere, one of the world's leading fire science researchers and
safety engineers, also encouraged his audience of fellow researchers
and engineers to scientifically re-examine the WTC collapses. "I hope
to convince you to perhaps become 'Conspiracy Theorists', but in a
proper way," he said.]

Notice the bit there where he ENCOURAGES experts to beomce "Conspiracy
Theorists" when looking into the collapse?

So just showing more fraud of your "List".

Tell me something, what CONSPIRACY would Quintiere be referring
to???????????????????

Post by Al Dykes

Post by Ah man

Post by t***@gmail.com

Post by Ah man

Post by t***@gmail.com

Post by Midex

Post by RichL
This was posted about six months ago and thoroughly discredited then.
Repeating a lie over and over again doesn't make it true.

lol. "totally discredited then".
Here is the consensus from the experts:www.ae911truth.org
The jury is in. It was a controlled demolition.

Your group of kooks do not make a "consensus", idiot

Qualified professional engineers and architects are "kooks" according
to Zionist troll loser Canberra resident, Chris Textor (aka Tex).

Well Jake, you're listed as one of their "qualified" experts, and your
only qualifications are in your mind, so you'll excuse me if I don't
take your kook group seriously.

Post by Ah man
Still waiting for you to find me a comparable list of engineers and
architects who publicly support the NIST Magic Fire explanation.

Why would they Jake? There's no reason for them to come out and
support and obvious truth.
Please find me 20 engineers who support the existence of corn flakes.
If you can't, they must not exist. Right Jakey?

Post by Ah man
I'll give you a $1000 if you can find me 20.

You don't have "$1000" Jakey. I've heard you can't even afford the
medication for your mental illness

Post by Ah man
You won't be able to
find even that many. I'd call 280 to 20 a fairly overwhelming expert
consensus.

No Jake, 280 across the entire planet isn't a "consensus", retard.

According to Chris Textor EVERY ENGINEER AND ARCHITECT in the world
has studied the collapses.
Notice Chris Textor can't find us a list of at least 20 engineers and
architects who support the NIST explanation? lol.

Abolhassan Astaneh-Asl, Ph.D., P.E.
Alan Rosa, P.E., S.E.
Allyn Kilsheimer, P.E.
Amit Bandyopadhyay, S.E.
Amy Zelson Mundorff
Anamaria Bonilla, S.E.
Andrew McConnell, S.E.
Andrew Mueller-Lust, S.E.
Andrew Pontecorvo, P.E.
Anthony Kirk US&R Structural Specialist
Anthony W. Chuliver, S.E.
Antoine E. Naaman, Ph.D.
Antranig M. Ouzoonian, P.E.
Arlan Dobson, FEMA Region 2 DAS
August Domel, Ph.D., S.E., P.E.
Bernie Denke US&R Structural Specialist
Bill Cote
Bill Coulbourne, P.E., S.E.
Bob Gray (I.U.O.E.)
Bonnie Manley, P.E., S.E.
Boris Hayda, P.E., S.E.
Brian Lyons, Tully
Brian McElhatten, S.E.
Brian Smith (Col.), Chief Deputy Medical Examiner, Dover AFB
Charles Hirsch, M.D.
Charles J. Carter, AISC
Charles Thornton, P.E.
Charlie Vitchers
Christopher E. Marrion, P.E.
Christopher M. Hewitt, AISC
Chuck Guardia, S.E.
D. Stanton Korista, P.E., S.E.
Dan Doyle (IW 40)
Dan Eschenasy, P.E., S.E.
Dan Koch Jr.
Daniel A. Cuoco, P.E
Daniele Veneziano, P.E.
David Davidowitz, ConEd
David Hoy, S.E.
David Leach, USACE
David M. Parks, ME
David Peraza, P.E., S.E.
David Ranlet
David Schomburg
David Sharp, S.E.
David T. Biggs, P.E.
Dean Koutsoubis, S.E.
Dean Tills, P.E.
Delbert Boring, P.E.
Dennis Clark (IST)
Dennis Dirkmaat, Ph.D.
Dennis Mileti, Ph.D.
Dennis Smith
Dick Posthauer, S.E.
Donald Friedman, P.E.
Donald O. Dusenberry, P.E.
Ed McGinley, P.E.
Ed Plaugher, Chief, Arlington FD
Edward A. Flynn, Arlington Police Chief
Edward Depaola, S.E.
Edward M. DePaola, P.E.
Edward Stinnette, Chief, FCFD
Fahim Sadek, P.E., S.E.
Farid Alfawakhiri Ph.D.
FDNY Battalion Chief Frank Vallebuono
FDNY Captain Anthony Varriale
FDNY Chief Frank Cruthers
FDNY Chief Frank Fellini
FDNY Chief Joseph Callan
FDNY Chief of Operations Daniel Nigro
FDNY Deputy Chief Nick Visconti
FDNY Deputy Chief Peter Hayden
FDNY Firefighter Sam Melisi
Francis J. Lombardi, P.E.
Frank Gayle, Sc.D.
Gary Keith, V.P. NFPA
Gary Steficek, S.E.
Gary Suson
Gary Tokle, Asst. VP, NFPA
George Tamaro, P.E., S.E.
Gerald Haynes, P.E.
Gerald Wellman US&R Structural Specialist
Guy Colonna, P.E., NFPA
Guylene Proulx, Ph.D.
H.S. Lew, P.E., S.E.
Hal Bidlack, Lt. Col. USAF (ret.), Ph.D.
Harold E. Nelson, P.E., FSFP.E.
Harry Martin, AISC
J. David Frost, Ph.D., P.E.
Jack Brown Deputy Chief Loudoun County (Va.) Fire Rescue Department
Jack Messagno, WTC project Manager (Tully)
James A. Rossberg, P.E.
James Chastain US&R Structural Specialist
James H. Fahey, S.E.
James Lord, FSFP.E.
James Milke, Ph.D., P.E.
Jan Szumanski, IUOE
Jason Averill, FSFP.E.
Jeffrey Hartman, S.E.
Jim Abadie, Bovis
Joel Meyerowitz
John Gross, Ph.D., P.E.
John Hodgens, FDNY (ret.)
John J. Zils, P.E., S.E.
John L. Gross, Ph.D., P.E.
John Lekstutis, P.E.
John M. Hanson, Ph.D, P.E.
John McArdle NYPD/ESU (DTC)
John Moran, NYPD/ESU (NTC)
John O'Connell
John Odermatt (NYC OEM)
John Ruddy, P.E., S.E.
John W. Fisher, P.E.
Jon Magnusson, P.E., S.E.
John Ryan, PAPD
Jonathan Barnett, Ph.D
Joo-Eun Lee P.E., S.E.
Joseph C. Gehlen, P.E., S.E.
Jozef Van Dyck, P.E.
Juan Paulo Morla, S.E.
Karl Koch III
Karl Koch IV
Kaspar Willam, P.E., S.E.
Kenneth Holden
Kent Watts
Kevin Brennan, OSHA
Kevin Malley, FDNY (ret.)
Kevin Terry, S.E.
Kurt Gustafson, P.E., S.E.
Larry Keating (IW 40)
Lawrence C. Bank, Ph.D., P.E.
Lawrence Griffis, P.E.
Leo J. Titus, P.E.
Leonard M. Joseph, P.E.
Leslie E. Robertson, P.E., S.E.
Long T. Phan, Ph.D., P.E.
Lou Mendes, P.E., S.E.
Louis Errichiello, S.E.
Manny Velivasakis, P.E.
Mark Blair
Mark Kucera, USACE
Mark Tamaro, P.E
Mark Volpe, IW 40
Marty Corcoran
Matthew G. Yerkey, P.E., S.E.
Merle E. Brander, P.E.
Mete A. Sozen, Ph.D., S.E.
Michael Burton, P.E.
Michael Dallal
Michael Hessheimer, S.E.
Michael Tylk, P.E., S.E.
Mike Banker, FDNY Capt. (SOC)
Mike Marscio, P.E.
Miroslav Sulc,, P.E., S.E.
Mohammed Ettouney
Morgan Hurley, FSFP.E.
Nestor Iwankiw, Ph.D., P.E.
Nick Carcich
Norman Groner, Ph.D.
Pablo Lopez, P.E., S.E.
Paul A. Bosela, Ph.D., P.E.
Paul F. Mlakar, Ph.D., P.E.
Paul Sledzik
Paul Tertell, P.E.
Pete Bakersky
Peter Chipchase, S.E.
Peter Rinaldi, P.E.
Pia Hoffman
Rajani Nair, S.E.
Ramon Gilsanz, P.E., S.E
Randy Lawson
Raul Maestre, P.E., S.E.
Raymond F. Messer, P.E.
Reidar Bjorhovde, Ph.D., P.E
Richard Bukowski P.E., FSFP.E.
Richard G. Gewain, P.E., S.E.
Richard Gann, Ph.D.
Richard Garlock, P.E., S.E.
Richard Kahler US&R Structural Specialist
Robert C. Sinn, P.E., S.E.
Robert F. Duval (NFPA)
Robert Frances US&R Structural Specialist
Robert J. McNamara, P.E., S.E.
Robert Ratay, Ph.D., P.E., S.E.
Robert Shaler, M.D.
Robert Smilowitz, Ph.D., P.E
Robert Solomon, P.E.
Robert Wills, AISC
Ronald Hamburger, P.E., S.E.
Ronald J. LaMere, P.E.
Ronald Rehm, Ph.D.
Ronald Spadafora, FDNY D.A.C
Ruben M. Zallen, P.E.
Russell "Rusty" Dodge Jr, Asst. Chief, Fort Belvoir FD
S. Shyam Sunder, P.E., S.E.
Saw-Teen See, P.E.
Shankar Nair. P.E., S.E.
Shawn Kelly, Arlington County Fire Marshal
Socrates Ioannides, P.E., S.E.
Sonny Scarff
Stan Murphy, P.E.
Stephen Cauffman
Steve Rasweiler, FDNY B.C. (SOC)
Stuart Foltz, P.E.
Terry Sullivan, Bovis
Theodore Galambos, P.E.
Theodore Krauthammer, Ph.D., P.E.
Therese P. McAllister, Ph.D., P.E.
Thomas Hawkins Jr, Chief, AFD
Thomas Schlafly, AISC
Todd Ude, P.E., S.E.
Tom Scarangello, P.E.
Tom Stanton (IST)
Tony Beale, P.E.
Valentine Junker
Venkatesh Kodur, Ph.D., P.E.
Victor Hare, P.E.
Vincent Dunn, FDNY (ret.)
W. Gene Corley, Ph.D., P.E., S.E.
W. Lee Evey
Wallace Miller
William Baker, P.E., S.E
William Grosshandler, Ph.D., ME
William McGuire, P.E.
Willie Quinlan, IW
Zdenek Bazant, Ph.D., S.E.
9/11 Commission & Staff
Thomas H. Kean, Chair
Lee H. Hamilton, Vice Chair
Richard Ben-Veniste
Fred F. Fielding
Jamie S. Gorelick
Slade Gorton
Bob Kerrey
John F. Lehman
Timothy J. Roemer
James R. Thompson
Joanne Accolla
Alexis Albion
Scott Allan
John Azzarello
Caroline Barnes
Warren Bass
Ann Bennett
Mark Bittinger
Madeleine Blot
Antwion Blount
Geoff Brown
Daniel Byman
Dianna Campagna
Sam Caspersen
Melissa Coffey
Lance Cole
Marquittia Coleman
Marco Cordero
Raj De Counsel
George Delgrosso
Gerald L. Dillingham
Thomas Dowling
Steven Dunne
Thomas Eldridge
John Farmer
Alvin Felzenberg
Gordon England
Lorry Fenner
Susan Ginsburg
T. Graham Giusti
Nicole Grandrimo
Doug Greenburg
Barbara Grewe
Elinore Hartz
Len Hawley
Christine Healey
Karen Heitkotter
Walt Hempel
Michael Hurley
Dana Hyde
Michael Jacobson
Bonnie Jenkins
Reginald Johnson
William Johnstone
Stephanie Kaplan
Miles Kara
Janice Kephart-Roberts
Hyon Kim
Christopher Kojm
Katarzyna (Kasia) Kozaczuk
Gordon Lederman
Daniel Leopold
Sarah Linden
Douglas MacEachin
Daniel Marcus
Ernest May
James Miller
--
Al Dykes
News is something someone wants to suppress, everything else is advertising.
- Lord Northcliffe, publisher of the Daily Mail

[Al Dykes]

Post by Ah man

Post by t***@gmail.com

Post by Midex

Post by RichL
This was posted about six months ago and thoroughly discredited then.
Repeating a lie over and over again doesn't make it true.

lol. "totally discredited then".
Here is the consensus from the experts:www.ae911truth.org
The jury is in. It was a controlled demolition.

Your group of kooks do not make a "consensus", idiot

Qualified professional engineers and architects are "kooks" according
to Zionist troll loser Canberra resident, Chris Textor (aka Tex).
Still waiting for you to find me a comparable list of engineers and
architects who publicly support the NIST Magic Fire explanation.
I'll give you a $1000 if you can find me 20. You won't be able to
find even that many. I'd call 280 to 20 a fairly overwhelming expert
consensus.

Abolhassan Astaneh-Asl, Ph.D., P.E.
Alan Rosa, P.E., S.E.
Allyn Kilsheimer, P.E.
Amit Bandyopadhyay, S.E.
Amy Zelson Mundorff
Anamaria Bonilla, S.E.
Andrew McConnell, S.E.
Andrew Mueller-Lust, S.E.
Andrew Pontecorvo, P.E.
Anthony Kirk US&R Structural Specialist
Anthony W. Chuliver, S.E.
Antoine E. Naaman, Ph.D.
Antranig M. Ouzoonian, P.E.
Arlan Dobson, FEMA Region 2 DAS
August Domel, Ph.D., S.E., P.E.
Bernie Denke US&R Structural Specialist
Bill Cote
Bill Coulbourne, P.E., S.E.
Bob Gray (I.U.O.E.)
Bonnie Manley, P.E., S.E.
Boris Hayda, P.E., S.E.
Brian Lyons, Tully
Brian McElhatten, S.E.
Brian Smith (Col.), Chief Deputy Medical Examiner, Dover AFB
Charles Hirsch, M.D.
Charles J. Carter, AISC
Charles Thornton, P.E.
Charlie Vitchers
Christopher E. Marrion, P.E.
Christopher M. Hewitt, AISC
Chuck Guardia, S.E.
D. Stanton Korista, P.E., S.E.
Dan Doyle (IW 40)
Dan Eschenasy, P.E., S.E.
Dan Koch Jr.
Daniel A. Cuoco, P.E
Daniele Veneziano, P.E.
David Davidowitz, ConEd
David Hoy, S.E.
David Leach, USACE
David M. Parks, ME
David Peraza, P.E., S.E.
David Ranlet
David Schomburg
David Sharp, S.E.
David T. Biggs, P.E.
Dean Koutsoubis, S.E.
Dean Tills, P.E.
Delbert Boring, P.E.
Dennis Clark (IST)
Dennis Dirkmaat, Ph.D.
Dennis Mileti, Ph.D.
Dennis Smith
Dick Posthauer, S.E.
Donald Friedman, P.E.
Donald O. Dusenberry, P.E.
Ed McGinley, P.E.
Ed Plaugher, Chief, Arlington FD
Edward A. Flynn, Arlington Police Chief
Edward Depaola, S.E.
Edward M. DePaola, P.E.
Edward Stinnette, Chief, FCFD
Fahim Sadek, P.E., S.E.
Farid Alfawakhiri Ph.D.
FDNY Battalion Chief Frank Vallebuono
FDNY Captain Anthony Varriale
FDNY Chief Frank Cruthers
FDNY Chief Frank Fellini
FDNY Chief Joseph Callan
FDNY Chief of Operations Daniel Nigro
FDNY Deputy Chief Nick Visconti
FDNY Deputy Chief Peter Hayden
FDNY Firefighter Sam Melisi
Francis J. Lombardi, P.E.
Frank Gayle, Sc.D.
Gary Keith, V.P. NFPA
Gary Steficek, S.E.
Gary Suson
Gary Tokle, Asst. VP, NFPA
George Tamaro, P.E., S.E.
Gerald Haynes, P.E.
Gerald Wellman US&R Structural Specialist
Guy Colonna, P.E., NFPA
Guylene Proulx, Ph.D.
H.S. Lew, P.E., S.E.
Hal Bidlack, Lt. Col. USAF (ret.), Ph.D.
Harold E. Nelson, P.E., FSFP.E.
Harry Martin, AISC
J. David Frost, Ph.D., P.E.
Jack Brown Deputy Chief Loudoun County (Va.) Fire Rescue Department
Jack Messagno, WTC project Manager (Tully)
James A. Rossberg, P.E.
James Chastain US&R Structural Specialist
James H. Fahey, S.E.
James Lord, FSFP.E.
James Milke, Ph.D., P.E.
Jan Szumanski, IUOE
Jason Averill, FSFP.E.
Jeffrey Hartman, S.E.
Jim Abadie, Bovis
Joel Meyerowitz
John Gross, Ph.D., P.E.
John Hodgens, FDNY (ret.)
John J. Zils, P.E., S.E.
John L. Gross, Ph.D., P.E.
John Lekstutis, P.E.
John M. Hanson, Ph.D, P.E.
John McArdle NYPD/ESU (DTC)
John Moran, NYPD/ESU (NTC)
John O'Connell
John Odermatt (NYC OEM)
John Ruddy, P.E., S.E.
John W. Fisher, P.E.
Jon Magnusson, P.E., S.E.
John Ryan, PAPD
Jonathan Barnett, Ph.D
Joo-Eun Lee P.E., S.E.
Joseph C. Gehlen, P.E., S.E.
Jozef Van Dyck, P.E.
Juan Paulo Morla, S.E.
Karl Koch III
Karl Koch IV
Kaspar Willam, P.E., S.E.
Kenneth Holden
Kent Watts
Kevin Brennan, OSHA
Kevin Malley, FDNY (ret.)
Kevin Terry, S.E.
Kurt Gustafson, P.E., S.E.
Larry Keating (IW 40)
Lawrence C. Bank, Ph.D., P.E.
Lawrence Griffis, P.E.
Leo J. Titus, P.E.
Leonard M. Joseph, P.E.
Leslie E. Robertson, P.E., S.E.
Long T. Phan, Ph.D., P.E.
Lou Mendes, P.E., S.E.
Louis Errichiello, S.E.
Manny Velivasakis, P.E.
Mark Blair
Mark Kucera, USACE
Mark Tamaro, P.E
Mark Volpe, IW 40
Marty Corcoran
Matthew G. Yerkey, P.E., S.E.
Merle E. Brander, P.E.
Mete A. Sozen, Ph.D., S.E.
Michael Burton, P.E.
Michael Dallal
Michael Hessheimer, S.E.
Michael Tylk, P.E., S.E.
Mike Banker, FDNY Capt. (SOC)
Mike Marscio, P.E.
Miroslav Sulc,, P.E., S.E.
Mohammed Ettouney
Morgan Hurley, FSFP.E.
Nestor Iwankiw, Ph.D., P.E.
Nick Carcich
Norman Groner, Ph.D.
Pablo Lopez, P.E., S.E.
Paul A. Bosela, Ph.D., P.E.
Paul F. Mlakar, Ph.D., P.E.
Paul Sledzik
Paul Tertell, P.E.
Pete Bakersky
Peter Chipchase, S.E.
Peter Rinaldi, P.E.
Pia Hoffman
Rajani Nair, S.E.
Ramon Gilsanz, P.E., S.E
Randy Lawson
Raul Maestre, P.E., S.E.
Raymond F. Messer, P.E.
Reidar Bjorhovde, Ph.D., P.E
Richard Bukowski P.E., FSFP.E.
Richard G. Gewain, P.E., S.E.
Richard Gann, Ph.D.
Richard Garlock, P.E., S.E.
Richard Kahler US&R Structural Specialist
Robert C. Sinn, P.E., S.E.
Robert F. Duval (NFPA)
Robert Frances US&R Structural Specialist
Robert J. McNamara, P.E., S.E.
Robert Ratay, Ph.D., P.E., S.E.
Robert Shaler, M.D.
Robert Smilowitz, Ph.D., P.E
Robert Solomon, P.E.
Robert Wills, AISC
Ronald Hamburger, P.E., S.E.
Ronald J. LaMere, P.E.
Ronald Rehm, Ph.D.
Ronald Spadafora, FDNY D.A.C
Ruben M. Zallen, P.E.
Russell "Rusty" Dodge Jr, Asst. Chief, Fort Belvoir FD
S. Shyam Sunder, P.E., S.E.
Saw-Teen See, P.E.
Shankar Nair. P.E., S.E.
Shawn Kelly, Arlington County Fire Marshal
Socrates Ioannides, P.E., S.E.
Sonny Scarff
Stan Murphy, P.E.
Stephen Cauffman
Steve Rasweiler, FDNY B.C. (SOC)
Stuart Foltz, P.E.
Terry Sullivan, Bovis
Theodore Galambos, P.E.
Theodore Krauthammer, Ph.D., P.E.
Therese P. McAllister, Ph.D., P.E.
Thomas Hawkins Jr, Chief, AFD
Thomas Schlafly, AISC
Todd Ude, P.E., S.E.
Tom Scarangello, P.E.
Tom Stanton (IST)
Tony Beale, P.E.
Valentine Junker
Venkatesh Kodur, Ph.D., P.E.
Victor Hare, P.E.
Vincent Dunn, FDNY (ret.)
W. Gene Corley, Ph.D., P.E., S.E.
W. Lee Evey
Wallace Miller
William Baker, P.E., S.E
William Grosshandler, Ph.D., ME
William McGuire, P.E.
Willie Quinlan, IW
Zdenek Bazant, Ph.D., S.E.

9/11 Commission & Staff
Thomas H. Kean, Chair
Lee H. Hamilton, Vice Chair
Richard Ben-Veniste
Fred F. Fielding
Jamie S. Gorelick
Slade Gorton
Bob Kerrey
John F. Lehman
Timothy J. Roemer
James R. Thompson

Joanne Accolla
Alexis Albion
Scott Allan
John Azzarello
Caroline Barnes
Warren Bass
Ann Bennett
Mark Bittinger
Madeleine Blot
Antwion Blount
Geoff Brown
Daniel Byman
Dianna Campagna
Sam Caspersen
Melissa Coffey
Lance Cole
Marquittia Coleman
Marco Cordero
Raj De Counsel
George Delgrosso
Gerald L. Dillingham
Thomas Dowling
Steven Dunne
Thomas Eldridge
John Farmer
Alvin Felzenberg
Gordon England
Lorry Fenner
Susan Ginsburg
T. Graham Giusti
Nicole Grandrimo
Doug Greenburg
Barbara Grewe
Elinore Hartz
Len Hawley
Christine Healey
Karen Heitkotter
Walt Hempel
Michael Hurley
Dana Hyde
Michael Jacobson
Bonnie Jenkins
Reginald Johnson
William Johnstone
Stephanie Kaplan
Miles Kara
Janice Kephart-Roberts
Hyon Kim
Christopher Kojm
Katarzyna (Kasia) Kozaczuk
Gordon Lederman
Daniel Leopold
Sarah Linden
Douglas MacEachin
Daniel Marcus
Ernest May
James Miller

Plus at least one person in each of these organizations.


CTL Engineering
D.H. Griffin Wrecking Co. Inc.
DeSimone Consulting Engineers
Dewhurst MacFarlane &Partners
DiSalvo Ericson Engineering
District of Columbia Fire & Rescue
DOD Honor Guard, Pentagon
D'Onofrio Construction
E-4B National Airborne Operations Center crews
Edwards and Kelcey Engineering
Engineering Systems, Inc.
Environmental protection Agency
Exponent Failure Analysis Associates
EYP Mission CriticalFacilities
Fairfax County Fire & Rescue
Falcon 20 crew in PA
Family members who received calls from victims on the planes
FBI Evidence Recovery Teams
Federal Aviation Administration
Federal Bureau of Investigation
Federal Emergency Management Agency
Federal Insurance Co.
FEMA 68-Person Urban Search and Rescue Teams: Arizona Task Force 1,
California Task Force 1,
California Task Force 3,
California Task Force 7,
Colorado Task Force 1,
Fairfax Task Force 1,
Florida Task Force 1,
Florida Task Force 2,
Maryland Task Force 1,
Massachusetts Task Force 1,
Metro Dade/Miami,
Nebraska Task Force 1,
New Mexico Task Force 1,
New York Task Force 1,
Pennsylvania Task Force 1,
Tennessee Task Force 1,
Texas Task Force 1,
Utah Task Force 1,
Virginia Task Force 1,
Virginia Task Force 2,
Washington Task Force 1
FEMA Disaster Field Office
FEMA Emergency Response Team
FEMA Urban Search and Rescue Incident Support Team-Advanced 3
Fire Department of New York
Fort Myer Fire Department
French Urban Search & Rescue Task Force
Friedens Volunteer Fire Department
Gateway Demolition
Gene Code Forensics
Georgia Tech Engineering Dept.
Gilsanz Murray Steficek LLP
GMAC Financing
Goldstein Associates Consulting Engineers
Guy Nordenson Associates
HAKS Engineers
Hampton-Clarke Inc.
HHS National Medical Response Team
HLW International Engineering
Hooversville Rescue Squad.
Hooversville Volunteer Fire Department
Hoy Structural Services
Hughes Associates, Inc
Hugo Neu Schnitzer East
hundreds of ironworkers, some of whom built the WTC
Hundreds of New York City Police Department Detectives
Industrial Risk Insurers
Institute for Civil Infrastructure Systems
International Association of Fire Chiefs
International Union of Operating Engineers Locals 14 & 15
J.R. Harris & Company
Karl Koch Steel Consulting Inc.
KCE Structural Engineers
Koch Skanska
Koutsoubis, Alonso Associates
Laboratory Corp. of America
Lamont-Doherty Earth Observatory
Leslie E. Robertson Associates
LIRo Engineering
Listie Volunteer Fire Company
Lockwood Consulting
M.G. McLaren Engineering
Masonry Society
Mazzocchi Wrecking Inc.
Metal Management Northeast
Metropolitan Airport Authority Fire Unit
Miami-Dade Urban Search & Rescue
Military District of Washington Search & Rescue Team
Montgomery County Fire & Rescue
Mueser Rutledge Consulting Engineers
Murray Engineering
Myriad Genetic Laboratories Inc.
National Center for Biotechnology Informatics
National Commission on Terrorist Attacks Upon the United States
National Council of Structural Engineers Associations
National Disaster Medical System
National Emergency Numbering Association
National Fire Protection Association
National Guard in D.C., New York, and Pennsylvania
National Institute of Standards and Technology (NIST)
National Institutes of Health Human Genome Research Institute
National Law Enforcement and Security Institute
National Military Command Center
National Reconnaissance Office
National Response Center
National Science Foundation Division of Civil and Mechanical Systems
National Security Agency
National Transportation Safety Board
National Wrecking
Natural Hazards Research and Applications Information Center
New Jersey State Police
New York City Department of Buildings WTC Task Force
New York City Department of Design and Construction
New York City Department of Environmental Protection
New York City Office of Emergency Management
New York City Office of the Chief Medical Examiner
New York City Police Department Aviation Unit
New York City Police Department Emergency Services Unit
New York Daily News
New York Flight Control Center
New York Newsday
New York Port Authority Construction Board
New York Port Authority Police
New York State Emergency Management Office
New York State Police Forensic Services
New York Times
North American Aerospace Defense Command
Northeast Air Defense Sector Commanders and crew
Numerous bomb-sniffing dogs
Numerous Forensic Anthropologists
Numerous Forensic Dentists
Numerous Forensic Pathologists
Numerous Forensic Radiologists
NuStats
Occupational Safety and Health Administration
Office of Emergency Preparedness
Office of Strategic Services
Orchid Cellmark
Parsons Brinckerhoff Engineering
Pennsylvania Department of Environmental Protection
Pennsylvania Department of Health and Human Services
Pennsylvania Region 13 Metropolitan Medical Response Group
Pennsylvania State Funeral Directors Association
Pennsylvania State Police
Pentagon Defense Protective Service
Pentagon Helicopter Crash Response Team
Pentagon Medical Staff
Pentagon Renovation Team
Phillips & Jordan, Inc.
Port of New York and New Jersey Authority
Pro-Safety Services
Protec
Public Entity Risk Institute
Purdue University Engineering Dept.
Robert Silman Associates Structural Engineers
Rolf Jensen & Associates, Inc
Rosenwasser/Grossman Consulting Engineers
Royal SunAlliance/Royal Indemnity
SACE Prime Power Assessment Teams
SACE Structural Safety Engineers and Debris Planning and Response Teams
Salvation Army Disaster Services
several EPA Hazmat Teams
several FBI Hazmat Teams
several Federal Disaster Medical Assistance Teams
several Federal Disaster Mortuary (DMORT) Teams
Severud Associates Consulting Engineers
Shanksville Volunteer Fire Company
Silverstein Properties
Simpson Gumpertz & Heger Engineers
Skidmore, Owings & Merrill LLP
Skilling Ward Magnusson Barkshire
Society of Fire Protection Engineers
Somerset Ambulance Association
Somerset County Coroner's Office
Somerset County Emergency Management Agency
Somerset Volunteer Fire Department
St. Paul/Travelers Insurance
State of Pennsylvania Emergency Management Agency
Stoystown Volunteer Fire Company
Structural Engineering Institute of the American Society of Civil Engineers (SEI/ASCE)
Structural Engineers Association of New York
Superstructures Engineering
Swiss Re America Insurance
Telephone operators who took calls from passengers in the hijacked planes
Teng & Associates
Thornton-Tomasetti Group, Inc.
TIG Insurance
Tokio Marine & Fire
Transportation Safety Administration
Tully Construction
Twin City Fire Insurance
Tylk Gustafson Reckers Wilson Andrews Engineering
U.S. Army Corps of Engineers
Underwriters Laboratories
Union Wrecking
United Airlines
United States Air National Guard
United States Fire Administration
United States Secret Service
United Steelworkers of America
University of Sheffield Fire Engineering Research
US Army Reserves of Virginia Beach Fairfax County and Montgomery County
US Army.s Communications-Electronics Command
US Department of Defense
US Department of Justice
US Department of State
Virginia Beach Fire Department
Virginia Department of Emergency Management
Virginia State Police
Vollmer Associates Engineers
Washington Post
Weeks Marine
Weidlinger Associates
Weiskopf & Pickworth Engineering
Westmoreland County Emergency Management Agency
Whitney Contracting
Willis Group Holdings
WJE Structural Engineers
Worcester Polytechnic Institute
World Trade Center security staff
XL Insurance
Yonkers Contracting
York International
Zurich Financial
Zurich Re Risk Engineering

Conspiracists: are these people liars, dupes, or shills?

[Ah man]

Post by Al Dykes

Post by Ah man

Post by t***@gmail.com

Post by Midex

Post by RichL
This was posted about six months ago and thoroughly discredited then.
Repeating a lie over and over again doesn't make it true.

lol. "totally discredited then".
Here is the consensus from the experts:www.ae911truth.org
The jury is in. It was a controlled demolition.

Your group of kooks do not make a "consensus", idiot

Qualified professional engineers and architects are "kooks" according
to Zionist troll loser Canberra resident, Chris Textor (aka Tex).
Still waiting for you to find me a comparable list of engineers and
architects who publicly support the NIST Magic Fire explanation.
I'll give you a $1000 if you can find me 20. You won't be able to
find even that many. I'd call 280 to 20 a fairly overwhelming expert
consensus.

Abolhassan Astaneh-Asl, Ph.D., P.E.
Alan Rosa, P.E., S.E.
Allyn Kilsheimer, P.E.
Amit Bandyopadhyay, S.E.
Amy Zelson Mundorff
Anamaria Bonilla, S.E.
Andrew McConnell, S.E.
Andrew Mueller-Lust, S.E.
Andrew Pontecorvo, P.E.
Anthony Kirk US&R Structural Specialist
Anthony W. Chuliver, S.E.
Antoine E. Naaman, Ph.D.
Antranig M. Ouzoonian, P.E.
Arlan Dobson, FEMA Region 2 DAS
August Domel, Ph.D., S.E., P.E.

None of these names have apparently endorsed NIST's magic-fire
report.
Further this is not a list of engineers and architects.

Post by Al Dykes
Bernie Denke US&R Structural Specialist
Bill Cote
Bill Coulbourne, P.E., S.E.
Bob Gray (I.U.O.E.)
Bonnie Manley, P.E., S.E.
Boris Hayda, P.E., S.E.
Brian Lyons, Tully
Brian McElhatten, S.E.
Brian Smith (Col.), Chief Deputy Medical Examiner, Dover AFB
Charles Hirsch, M.D.
Charles J. Carter, AISC
Charles Thornton, P.E.
Charlie Vitchers
Christopher E. Marrion, P.E.
Christopher M. Hewitt, AISC
Chuck Guardia, S.E.
D. Stanton Korista, P.E., S.E.
Dan Doyle (IW 40)
Dan Eschenasy, P.E., S.E.
Dan Koch Jr.
Daniel A. Cuoco, P.E
Daniele Veneziano, P.E.
David Davidowitz, ConEd
David Hoy, S.E.
David Leach, USACE
David M. Parks, ME
David Peraza, P.E., S.E.
David Ranlet
David Schomburg
David Sharp, S.E.
David T. Biggs, P.E.
Dean Koutsoubis, S.E.
Dean Tills, P.E.
Delbert Boring, P.E.
Dennis Clark (IST)
Dennis Dirkmaat, Ph.D.
Dennis Mileti, Ph.D.
Dennis Smith
Dick Posthauer, S.E.
Donald Friedman, P.E.
Donald O. Dusenberry, P.E.
Ed McGinley, P.E.
Ed Plaugher, Chief, Arlington FD
Edward A. Flynn, Arlington Police Chief
Edward Depaola, S.E.
Edward M. DePaola, P.E.
Edward Stinnette, Chief, FCFD
Fahim Sadek, P.E., S.E.
Farid Alfawakhiri Ph.D.
FDNY Battalion Chief Frank Vallebuono
FDNY Captain Anthony Varriale
FDNY Chief Frank Cruthers
FDNY Chief Frank Fellini
FDNY Chief Joseph Callan
FDNY Chief of Operations Daniel Nigro
FDNY Deputy Chief Nick Visconti
FDNY Deputy Chief Peter Hayden
FDNY Firefighter Sam Melisi
Francis J. Lombardi, P.E.
Frank Gayle, Sc.D.
Gary Keith, V.P. NFPA
Gary Steficek, S.E.
Gary Suson
Gary Tokle, Asst. VP, NFPA
George Tamaro, P.E., S.E.
Gerald Haynes, P.E.
Gerald Wellman US&R Structural Specialist
Guy Colonna, P.E., NFPA
Guylene Proulx, Ph.D.
H.S. Lew, P.E., S.E.
Hal Bidlack, Lt. Col. USAF (ret.), Ph.D.
Harold E. Nelson, P.E., FSFP.E.
Harry Martin, AISC
J. David Frost, Ph.D., P.E.
Jack Brown Deputy Chief Loudoun County (Va.) Fire Rescue Department
Jack Messagno, WTC project Manager (Tully)
James A. Rossberg, P.E.
James Chastain US&R Structural Specialist
James H. Fahey, S.E.
James Lord, FSFP.E.
James Milke, Ph.D., P.E.
Jan Szumanski, IUOE
Jason Averill, FSFP.E.
Jeffrey Hartman, S.E.
Jim Abadie, Bovis
Joel Meyerowitz
John Gross, Ph.D., P.E.
John Hodgens, FDNY (ret.)
John J. Zils, P.E., S.E.
John L. Gross, Ph.D., P.E.
John Lekstutis, P.E.
John M. Hanson, Ph.D, P.E.
John McArdle NYPD/ESU (DTC)
John Moran, NYPD/ESU (NTC)
John O'Connell
John Odermatt (NYC OEM)
John Ruddy, P.E., S.E.
John W. Fisher, P.E.
Jon Magnusson, P.E., S.E.
John Ryan, PAPD
Jonathan Barnett, Ph.D
Joo-Eun Lee P.E., S.E.
Joseph C. Gehlen, P.E., S.E.
Jozef Van Dyck, P.E.
Juan Paulo Morla, S.E.
Karl Koch III
Karl Koch IV
Kaspar Willam, P.E., S.E.
Kenneth Holden
Kent Watts
Kevin Brennan, OSHA
Kevin Malley, FDNY (ret.)
Kevin Terry, S.E.
Kurt Gustafson, P.E., S.E.
Larry Keating (IW 40)
Lawrence C. Bank, Ph.D., P.E.
Lawrence Griffis, P.E.
Leo J. Titus, P.E.
Leonard M. Joseph, P.E.
Leslie E. Robertson, P.E., S.E.
Long T. Phan, Ph.D., P.E.
Lou Mendes, P.E., S.E.
Louis Errichiello, S.E.
Manny Velivasakis, P.E.
Mark Blair
Mark Kucera, USACE
Mark Tamaro, P.E
Mark Volpe, IW 40
Marty Corcoran
Matthew G. Yerkey, P.E., S.E.
Merle E. Brander, P.E.
Mete A. Sozen, Ph.D., S.E.
Michael Burton, P.E.
Michael Dallal
Michael Hessheimer, S.E.
Michael Tylk, P.E., S.E.
Mike Banker, FDNY Capt. (SOC)
Mike Marscio, P.E.
Miroslav Sulc,, P.E., S.E.
Mohammed Ettouney
Morgan Hurley, FSFP.E.
Nestor Iwankiw, Ph.D., P.E.
Nick Carcich
Norman Groner, Ph.D.
Pablo Lopez, P.E., S.E.
Paul A. Bosela, Ph.D., P.E.
Paul F. Mlakar, Ph.D., P.E.
Paul Sledzik
Paul Tertell, P.E.
Pete Bakersky
Peter Chipchase, S.E.
Peter Rinaldi, P.E.
Pia Hoffman
Rajani Nair, S.E.
Ramon Gilsanz, P.E., S.E
Randy Lawson
Raul Maestre, P.E., S.E.
Raymond F. Messer, P.E.
Reidar Bjorhovde, Ph.D., P.E
Richard Bukowski P.E., FSFP.E.
Richard G. Gewain, P.E., S.E.
Richard Gann, Ph.D.
Richard Garlock, P.E., S.E.
Richard Kahler US&R Structural Specialist
Robert C. Sinn, P.E., S.E.
Robert F. Duval (NFPA)
Robert Frances US&R Structural Specialist
Robert J. McNamara, P.E., S.E.
Robert Ratay, Ph.D., P.E., S.E.
Robert Shaler, M.D.
Robert Smilowitz, Ph.D., P.E
Robert Solomon, P.E.
Robert Wills, AISC
Ronald Hamburger, P.E., S.E.
Ronald J. LaMere, P.E.
Ronald Rehm, Ph.D.
Ronald Spadafora, FDNY D.A.C
Ruben M. Zallen, P.E.
Russell "Rusty" Dodge Jr, Asst. Chief, Fort Belvoir FD
S. Shyam Sunder, P.E., S.E.
Saw-Teen See, P.E.
Shankar Nair. P.E., S.E.
Shawn Kelly, Arlington County Fire Marshal
Socrates Ioannides, P.E., S.E.
Sonny Scarff
Stan Murphy, P.E.
Stephen Cauffman
Steve Rasweiler, FDNY B.C. (SOC)
Stuart Foltz, P.E.
Terry Sullivan, Bovis
Theodore Galambos, P.E.
Theodore Krauthammer, Ph.D., P.E.
Therese P. McAllister, Ph.D., P.E.
Thomas Hawkins Jr, Chief, AFD
Thomas Schlafly, AISC
Todd Ude, P.E., S.E.
Tom Scarangello, P.E.
Tom Stanton (IST)
Tony Beale, P.E.
Valentine Junker
Venkatesh Kodur, Ph.D., P.E.
Victor Hare, P.E.
Vincent Dunn, FDNY (ret.)
W. Gene Corley, Ph.D., P.E., S.E.
W. Lee Evey
Wallace Miller
William Baker, P.E., S.E
William Grosshandler, Ph.D., ME
William McGuire, P.E.
Willie Quinlan, IW
Zdenek Bazant, Ph.D., S.E.
9/11 Commission & Staff
Thomas H. Kean, Chair
Lee H. Hamilton, Vice Chair
Richard Ben-Veniste
Fred F. Fielding
Jamie S. Gorelick
Slade Gorton
Bob Kerrey
John F. Lehman
Timothy J. Roemer
James R. Thompson
Joanne Accolla
Alexis Albion
Scott Allan
John Azzarello
Caroline Barnes
Warren Bass
Ann Bennett
Mark Bittinger
Madeleine Blot
Antwion Blount
Geoff Brown
Daniel Byman
Dianna Campagna
Sam Caspersen
Melissa Coffey
Lance Cole
Marquittia Coleman
Marco Cordero
Raj De Counsel
George Delgrosso
Gerald L. Dillingham
Thomas Dowling
Steven Dunne
Thomas Eldridge
John Farmer
Alvin Felzenberg
Gordon England
Lorry Fenner
Susan Ginsburg
T. Graham Giusti
Nicole Grandrimo
Doug Greenburg
Barbara Grewe
Elinore Hartz
Len Hawley
Christine Healey
Karen Heitkotter
Walt Hempel
Michael Hurley
Dana Hyde
Michael Jacobson
Bonnie Jenkins
Reginald Johnson
William Johnstone
Stephanie Kaplan
Miles Kara
Janice Kephart-Roberts
Hyon Kim
Christopher Kojm
Katarzyna (Kasia) Kozaczuk
Gordon Lederman
Daniel Leopold
Sarah Linden
Douglas MacEachin
Daniel Marcus
Ernest May
James Miller
Plus at least one person in each of these organizations.
CTL Engineering
D.H. Griffin Wrecking Co. Inc.
DeSimone Consulting Engineers
Dewhurst MacFarlane &Partners
DiSalvo Ericson Engineering
District of Columbia Fire & Rescue
DOD Honor Guard, Pentagon
D'Onofrio Construction
E-4B National Airborne Operations Center crews
Edwards and Kelcey Engineering
Engineering Systems, Inc.
Environmental protection Agency
Exponent Failure Analysis Associates
EYP Mission CriticalFacilities
Fairfax County Fire & Rescue
Falcon 20 crew in PA
Family members who received calls from victims on the planes
FBI Evidence Recovery Teams
Federal Aviation Administration
Federal Bureau of Investigation
Federal Emergency Management Agency
Federal Insurance Co.
FEMA 68-Person Urban Search and Rescue Teams: Arizona Task Force 1,
California Task Force 1,
California Task Force 3,
California Task Force 7,
Colorado Task Force 1,
Fairfax Task Force 1,
Florida Task Force 1,
Florida Task Force 2,
Maryland Task Force 1,
Massachusetts Task Force 1,
Metro Dade/Miami,
Nebraska Task Force 1,
New Mexico Task Force 1,
New York Task Force 1,
Pennsylvania Task Force 1,
Tennessee Task Force 1,
Texas Task Force 1,
Utah Task Force 1,
Virginia Task Force 1,
Virginia Task Force 2,
Washington Task Force 1
FEMA Disaster Field Office
FEMA Emergency Response Team
FEMA Urban Search and Rescue Incident Support Team-Advanced 3
Fire Department of New York
Fort Myer Fire Department
French Urban Search & Rescue Task Force
Friedens Volunteer Fire Department
Gateway Demolition
Gene Code Forensics
Georgia Tech Engineering Dept.
Gilsanz Murray Steficek LLP
GMAC Financing
Goldstein Associates Consulting Engineers
Guy Nordenson Associates
HAKS Engineers
Hampton-Clarke Inc.
HHS National Medical Response Team
HLW International Engineering
Hooversville Rescue Squad.
Hooversville Volunteer Fire Department
Hoy Structural Services
Hughes Associates, Inc
Hugo Neu Schnitzer East
hundreds of ironworkers, some of whom built the WTC
Hundreds of New York City Police Department Detectives
Industrial Risk Insurers
Institute for Civil Infrastructure Systems
International Association of Fire Chiefs
International Union of Operating Engineers Locals 14 & 15
J.R. Harris & Company
Karl Koch Steel Consulting Inc.
KCE Structural Engineers
Koch Skanska
Koutsoubis,...
read more »

[Al Dykes]

Post by Ah man
om>,

Post by Al Dykes

Post by Ah man

Post by t***@gmail.com

Post by Midex

This was posted about six months ago and thoroughly discredited the=

n.

Post by Al Dykes

Post by Ah man

Post by t***@gmail.com

Post by Midex

Repeating a lie over and over again doesn't make it true.

lol. "totally discredited then".
Here is the consensus from the experts:www.ae911truth.org
The jury is in. It was a controlled demolition.

Your group of kooks do not make a "consensus", idiot

Qualified professional engineers and architects are "kooks" according
to Zionist troll loser Canberra resident, Chris Textor (aka Tex).
Still waiting for you to find me a comparable list of engineers and
architects who publicly support the NIST Magic Fire explanation.
I'll give you a $1000 if you can find me 20. You won't be able to
find even that many. I'd call 280 to 20 a fairly overwhelming expert
consensus.

Abolhassan Astaneh-Asl, Ph.D., P.E.
Alan Rosa, P.E., S.E.
Allyn Kilsheimer, P.E.
Amit Bandyopadhyay, S.E.
Amy Zelson Mundorff
Anamaria Bonilla, S.E.
Andrew McConnell, S.E.
Andrew Mueller-Lust, S.E.
Andrew Pontecorvo, P.E.
Anthony Kirk US&R Structural Specialist
Anthony W. Chuliver, S.E.
Antoine E. Naaman, Ph.D.
Antranig M. Ouzoonian, P.E.
Arlan Dobson, FEMA Region 2 DAS
August Domel, Ph.D., S.E., P.E.

None of these names have apparently endorsed NIST's magic-fire
report.
Further this is not a list of engineers and architects.

You just make shit up as you go along and hope the rubes that listen to
you know even less than you do.

Anyone with a P.E. in the title is a very senior licensed engineer
who's statements have legal consequences. It would be stupid for one
or all of them to make a statement that was later shown to be wrong.
They all risked their careers if WTC was shown to not be what they
said it was.

The fact that you don't know that tells us that you are ignorant of
how the the engineering profession works. A "P.E" title is commonly
required to be an expert witness in a court case.


That list is made of the members and consultants to the 9/11
commission and NIST and people that have published research related to
the collapse of the towers.

Many of them have signed their names to teh Popular Mechanics 9/11
report which is a retelling of the NIST

http://www.popularmechanics.com/technology/military_law/1227842.html?page=9

[Ah man]

Post by Al Dykes

Post by Ah man
om>,

Post by Al Dykes

Post by Ah man

Post by t***@gmail.com

Post by Midex

This was posted about six months ago and thoroughly discredited the=

n.

Post by Al Dykes

Post by Ah man

Post by t***@gmail.com

Post by Midex

Repeating a lie over and over again doesn't make it true.

lol. "totally discredited then".
Here is the consensus from the experts:www.ae911truth.org
The jury is in. It was a controlled demolition.

Your group of kooks do not make a "consensus", idiot

Qualified professional engineers and architects are "kooks" according
to Zionist troll loser Canberra resident, Chris Textor (aka Tex).
Still waiting for you to find me a comparable list of engineers and
architects who publicly support the NIST Magic Fire explanation.
I'll give you a $1000 if you can find me 20. You won't be able to
find even that many. I'd call 280 to 20 a fairly overwhelming expert
consensus.

Abolhassan Astaneh-Asl, Ph.D., P.E.
Alan Rosa, P.E., S.E.
Allyn Kilsheimer, P.E.
Amit Bandyopadhyay, S.E.
Amy Zelson Mundorff
Anamaria Bonilla, S.E.
Andrew McConnell, S.E.
Andrew Mueller-Lust, S.E.
Andrew Pontecorvo, P.E.
Anthony Kirk US&R Structural Specialist
Anthony W. Chuliver, S.E.
Antoine E. Naaman, Ph.D.
Antranig M. Ouzoonian, P.E.
Arlan Dobson, FEMA Region 2 DAS
August Domel, Ph.D., S.E., P.E.

None of these names have apparently endorsed NIST's magic-fire
report.
Further this is not a list of engineers and architects.

You just make shit up as you go along and hope the rubes that listen to
you know even less than you do.
Anyone with a P.E. in the title is a very senior licensed engineer
who's statements have legal consequences.

Legal Consequences? lol. You talking about the lying about WMDs to get
us into the war? You mean like those kind of Legal Consequences?
Fucking idiot.

Have a look at the first name on the list:
Abolhassan Astaneh-Asl, Ph.D., P.E.

Look him up. He's made alot of money out of supporting NIST's little
magic-fire theory.


We could go through every name on that list and expose the frauds.
Actually I think this is a project for ae911truth. I might just start
it with that first name Abolhassan Astaneh-Asl, Ph.D., P.E.

And by the way, which of all the names you listed are architects or
engineers? And what is their public statements regarding the
collapses?

You havn't shown that there are even 20. And I bet there arn't 290
thats for sure.

Post by Al Dykes
It would be stupid for one
or all of them to make a statement that was later shown to be wrong.
They all risked their careers if WTC was shown to not be what they
said it was.
The fact that you don't know that tells us that you are ignorant of
how the the engineering profession works. A "P.E" title is commonly
required to be an expert witness in a court case.
That list is made of the members and consultants to the 9/11
commission and NIST and people that have published research related to
the collapse of the towers.
Many of them have signed their names to teh Popular Mechanics 9/11
report which is a retelling of the NIST
http://www.popularmechanics.com/technology/military_law/1227842.html?...
--
Al Dykes
News is something someone wants to suppress, everything else is advertising.
- Lord Northcliffe, publisher of the Daily Mail

[Al Dykes]

Post by Ah man

Post by Al Dykes

Post by Ah man
om>,

Post by Al Dykes

Post by Ah man

Post by t***@gmail.com

Post by Midex

This was posted about six months ago and thoroughly discredited the=

n.

Post by Al Dykes

Post by Ah man

Post by t***@gmail.com

Post by Midex

Repeating a lie over and over again doesn't make it true.

lol. "totally discredited then".
Here is the consensus from the experts:www.ae911truth.org
The jury is in. It was a controlled demolition.

Your group of kooks do not make a "consensus", idiot

Qualified professional engineers and architects are "kooks" according
to Zionist troll loser Canberra resident, Chris Textor (aka Tex).
Still waiting for you to find me a comparable list of engineers and
architects who publicly support the NIST Magic Fire explanation.
I'll give you a $1000 if you can find me 20. You won't be able to
find even that many. I'd call 280 to 20 a fairly overwhelming expert
consensus.

Abolhassan Astaneh-Asl, Ph.D., P.E.
Alan Rosa, P.E., S.E.
Allyn Kilsheimer, P.E.
Amit Bandyopadhyay, S.E.
Amy Zelson Mundorff
Anamaria Bonilla, S.E.
Andrew McConnell, S.E.
Andrew Mueller-Lust, S.E.
Andrew Pontecorvo, P.E.
Anthony Kirk US&R Structural Specialist
Anthony W. Chuliver, S.E.
Antoine E. Naaman, Ph.D.
Antranig M. Ouzoonian, P.E.
Arlan Dobson, FEMA Region 2 DAS
August Domel, Ph.D., S.E., P.E.

None of these names have apparently endorsed NIST's magic-fire
report.
Further this is not a list of engineers and architects.

You just make shit up as you go along and hope the rubes that listen to
you know even less than you do.
Anyone with a P.E. in the title is a very senior licensed engineer
who's statements have legal consequences.

Legal Consequences? lol. You talking about the lying about WMDs to get
us into the war? You mean like those kind of Legal Consequences?
Fucking idiot.
Abolhassan Astaneh-Asl, Ph.D., P.E.
Look him up. He's made alot of money out of supporting NIST's little
magic-fire theory.

SO what? Make a specific claim.

ae911 is a money making scam. This is from Gage's own website.

Quote:
Citizen / Student - $10/month - 20 WTC Evidence and 20 Twin Towers Cards
Advocate - $25/month - DVD: 9/11 Blueprint for Truth + 20 of each card
Activist - $50/month - 2 DVD's + 50 of each card
Patriot - $100/month - 3 DVD's + 100 of each card
Statesman - $250/month - 5 DVD's + 250 of each card
Ambassador - $500/month - 10 DVD's + 500 of each card
AE911Truth Hero - $911/month - 20 DVD's + 1000 of each card
Donate $9.00 - Take an Architect or Engineer to Lunch!
Donate $50.00 - Take a few A/E's out to Lunch!
Donate $90.00 - Take a small A/E firm to Lunch!
Donate $500.00 - Take a medium A/E firm to Lunch!
Donate $900.00 - Take a large A/E firm to lunch!

http://www.ae911truth.org/sustain.php

[Ah man]

Post by Al Dykes

Post by Ah man

Post by Al Dykes

Post by Ah man
om>,

Post by Al Dykes

Post by Ah man

Post by t***@gmail.com

Post by Midex

This was posted about six months ago and thoroughly discredited the=

n.

Post by Al Dykes

Post by Ah man

Post by t***@gmail.com

Post by Midex

Repeating a lie over and over again doesn't make it true.

lol. "totally discredited then".
Here is the consensus from the experts:www.ae911truth.org
The jury is in. It was a controlled demolition.

Your group of kooks do not make a "consensus", idiot

Qualified professional engineers and architects are "kooks" according
to Zionist troll loser Canberra resident, Chris Textor (aka Tex).
Still waiting for you to find me a comparable list of engineers and
architects who publicly support the NIST Magic Fire explanation.
I'll give you a $1000 if you can find me 20. You won't be able to
find even that many. I'd call 280 to 20 a fairly overwhelming expert
consensus.

Abolhassan Astaneh-Asl, Ph.D., P.E.
Alan Rosa, P.E., S.E.
Allyn Kilsheimer, P.E.
Amit Bandyopadhyay, S.E.
Amy Zelson Mundorff
Anamaria Bonilla, S.E.
Andrew McConnell, S.E.
Andrew Mueller-Lust, S.E.
Andrew Pontecorvo, P.E.
Anthony Kirk US&R Structural Specialist
Anthony W. Chuliver, S.E.
Antoine E. Naaman, Ph.D.
Antranig M. Ouzoonian, P.E.
Arlan Dobson, FEMA Region 2 DAS
August Domel, Ph.D., S.E., P.E.

None of these names have apparently endorsed NIST's magic-fire
report.
Further this is not a list of engineers and architects.

You just make shit up as you go along and hope the rubes that listen to
you know even less than you do.
Anyone with a P.E. in the title is a very senior licensed engineer
who's statements have legal consequences.

Legal Consequences? lol. You talking about the lying about WMDs to get
us into the war? You mean like those kind of Legal Consequences?
Fucking idiot.
Abolhassan Astaneh-Asl, Ph.D., P.E.
Look him up. He's made alot of money out of supporting NIST's little
magic-fire theory.

SO what? Make a specific claim.

Lets just shove your own words down your own throat: You say elsewhere
here that your little list of NIST affiliates contains Engeering
"P.E"s and that P.E's are the level of engineers that Courts of Law
call to be expert witnesses.

Well there are more P.E.'s in the list at www.ae911truth.org than in
your fuckwit fraudulent piece of shit NIST report list.

Post by Al Dykes
ae911 is a money making scam. This is from Gage's own website.
Citizen / Student - $10/month - 20 WTC Evidence and 20 Twin Towers Cards
Advocate - $25/month - DVD: 9/11 Blueprint for Truth + 20 of each card
Activist - $50/month - 2 DVD's + 50 of each card
Patriot - $100/month - 3 DVD's + 100 of each card
Statesman - $250/month - 5 DVD's + 250 of each card
Ambassador - $500/month - 10 DVD's + 500 of each card
AE911Truth Hero - $911/month - 20 DVD's + 1000 of each card
Donate $9.00 - Take an Architect or Engineer to Lunch!
Donate $50.00 - Take a few A/E's out to Lunch!
Donate $90.00 - Take a small A/E firm to Lunch!
Donate $500.00 - Take a medium A/E firm to Lunch!
Donate $900.00 - Take a large A/E firm to lunch!
http://www.ae911truth.org/sustain.php

Thats called a Volunteer organisation. Do you think that Richard Gage
should fund the entire activist organisation himself do you?

Post by Al Dykes
--
Al Dykes
News is something someone wants to suppress, everything else is advertising.
- Lord Northcliffe, publisher of the Daily Mail

[Ah man]

Post by Al Dykes

Post by Ah man

Post by Al Dykes

Post by Ah man
om>,

Post by Al Dykes

Post by Ah man

Post by t***@gmail.com

Post by Midex

This was posted about six months ago and thoroughly discredited the=

n.

Post by Al Dykes

Post by Ah man

Post by t***@gmail.com

Post by Midex

Repeating a lie over and over again doesn't make it true.

lol. "totally discredited then".
Here is the consensus from the experts:www.ae911truth.org
The jury is in. It was a controlled demolition.

Your group of kooks do not make a "consensus", idiot

Qualified professional engineers and architects are "kooks" according
to Zionist troll loser Canberra resident, Chris Textor (aka Tex).
Still waiting for you to find me a comparable list of engineers and
architects who publicly support the NIST Magic Fire explanation.
I'll give you a $1000 if you can find me 20. You won't be able to
find even that many. I'd call 280 to 20 a fairly overwhelming expert
consensus.

Abolhassan Astaneh-Asl, Ph.D., P.E.
Alan Rosa, P.E., S.E.
Allyn Kilsheimer, P.E.
Amit Bandyopadhyay, S.E.
Amy Zelson Mundorff
Anamaria Bonilla, S.E.
Andrew McConnell, S.E.
Andrew Mueller-Lust, S.E.
Andrew Pontecorvo, P.E.
Anthony Kirk US&R Structural Specialist
Anthony W. Chuliver, S.E.
Antoine E. Naaman, Ph.D.
Antranig M. Ouzoonian, P.E.
Arlan Dobson, FEMA Region 2 DAS
August Domel, Ph.D., S.E., P.E.

None of these names have apparently endorsed NIST's magic-fire
report.
Further this is not a list of engineers and architects.

You just make shit up as you go along and hope the rubes that listen to
you know even less than you do.
Anyone with a P.E. in the title is a very senior licensed engineer
who's statements have legal consequences.

Legal Consequences? lol. You talking about the lying about WMDs to get
us into the war? You mean like those kind of Legal Consequences?
Fucking idiot.
Abolhassan Astaneh-Asl, Ph.D., P.E.
Look him up. He's made alot of money out of supporting NIST's little
magic-fire theory.

SO what? Make a specific claim.

Hey all Dykes, you just boasted that your list of NIST supporters
contains P.E. engineers and that these are the most senior engineers.
Pity that there are more P.E engineers at www.ae911truth.org than
there are in your little NIST jew cabal.

Post by Al Dykes
ae911 is a money making scam. This is from Gage's own website.
Citizen / Student - $10/month - 20 WTC Evidence and 20 Twin Towers Cards
Advocate - $25/month - DVD: 9/11 Blueprint for Truth + 20 of each card
Activist - $50/month - 2 DVD's + 50 of each card
Patriot - $100/month - 3 DVD's + 100 of each card
Statesman - $250/month - 5 DVD's + 250 of each card
Ambassador - $500/month - 10 DVD's + 500 of each card
AE911Truth Hero - $911/month - 20 DVD's + 1000 of each card
Donate $9.00 - Take an Architect or Engineer to Lunch!
Donate $50.00 - Take a few A/E's out to Lunch!
Donate $90.00 - Take a small A/E firm to Lunch!
Donate $500.00 - Take a medium A/E firm to Lunch!
Donate $900.00 - Take a large A/E firm to lunch!
http://www.ae911truth.org/sustain.php
--
Al Dykes
News is something someone wants to suppress, everything else is advertising.
- Lord Northcliffe, publisher of the Daily Mail

[Snit]

Post by Ah man

Post by Al Dykes
SO what? Make a specific claim.

Hey all Dykes, you just boasted that your list of NIST supporters
contains P.E. engineers and that these are the most senior engineers.
Pity that there are more P.E engineers at www.ae911truth.org than
there are in your little NIST jew cabal.

The collapse of the towers might - just might - have been due to really big
fast moving hunks of metal that, unfortunately, slammed into them.

Just a theory mind you...

sigh...

[Midex]

Post by Al Dykes

Post by Ah man
om>,

Post by Al Dykes

Post by Ah man

Post by t***@gmail.com

Post by Midex

This was posted about six months ago and thoroughly discredited the=

n.

Post by Al Dykes

Post by Ah man

Post by t***@gmail.com

Post by Midex

Repeating a lie over and over again doesn't make it true.

lol. "totally discredited then".
Here is the consensus from the experts:www.ae911truth.org
The jury is in. It was a controlled demolition.

Your group of kooks do not make a "consensus", idiot

Qualified professional engineers and architects are "kooks" according
to Zionist troll loser Canberra resident, Chris Textor (aka Tex).
Still waiting for you to find me a comparable list of engineers and
architects who publicly support the NIST Magic Fire explanation.
I'll give you a $1000 if you can find me 20. You won't be able to
find even that many. I'd call 280 to 20 a fairly overwhelming expert
consensus.

Abolhassan Astaneh-Asl, Ph.D., P.E.
Alan Rosa, P.E., S.E.
Allyn Kilsheimer, P.E.
Amit Bandyopadhyay, S.E.
Amy Zelson Mundorff
Anamaria Bonilla, S.E.
Andrew McConnell, S.E.
Andrew Mueller-Lust, S.E.
Andrew Pontecorvo, P.E.
Anthony Kirk US&R Structural Specialist
Anthony W. Chuliver, S.E.
Antoine E. Naaman, Ph.D.
Antranig M. Ouzoonian, P.E.
Arlan Dobson, FEMA Region 2 DAS
August Domel, Ph.D., S.E., P.E.

None of these names have apparently endorsed NIST's magic-fire
report.
Further this is not a list of engineers and architects.

You just make shit up as you go along and hope the rubes that listen to
you know even less than you do.
Anyone with a P.E. in the title is a very senior licensed engineer
who's statements have legal consequences. It would be stupid for one
or all of them to make a statement that was later shown to be wrong.
They all risked their careers if WTC was shown to not be what they
said it was.
The fact that you don't know that tells us that you are ignorant of
how the the engineering profession works. A "P.E" title is commonly
required to be an expert witness in a court case.

Is that right? How many are there at ae911truth.org? "Principal
Engineer" right? So if we had a COURT CASE and lined up the witnesses
then the conclusion would have to be that it was a controlled
demolition wouldn't it.

All of the following P.E. engineers suppport the controlled demolition
(i.e. explosives were used to bring the towers down)
http://www.ae911truth.org/signpetition.php

Alexander Ridgely Thorp, P.E.
Lic: 46314 MA
B.S. Civil Engineering, WPI
Great Barrington, MA


Andrew C. Mills, Principal Engineer *
Lic: New Jersey Professional Engineer 23891 (24GE023891
M.S. Eng.
Lower Gwynedd, PA

Albert V. Burns, P.E. (Ret. AZ. Prof. Civil Engr.) *
Lic: AZ civil engineer #2631, status: retired
BS Civ. Engr. Univ. Of AZ. 1951
Spanish Fork, UT

Arthur L. Carran, Engineer, P.E.
Lic: Professional Engineer 58264 Ohio
B.S., Aerospace Engineering Technology
Fairfield, OH

Ben J. Marshall, Senior Engineer, PE
Lic: 34273 MD, 22286 KY
MS Chemical Engineering
Jacksonville, FL

Bill H. Metcalf, P.E.
Lic: 46148 TX
BS Engineering Texas A&M 1967
Athens, TX

Charles A. Marshall, PE, MSCE *
Lic: 9396 civil engineer exp 2008
MS, Civil Engineering,USC
San Gabriel, CA

Charles N. Pegelow, PE, Civil Engineer. lic Calif CE 26344 (Structural
Lic: Calif license 26344 Civil Engineer, exp 2008
Houston, TX
http://www.ae911truth.org/supporters.php?g=_AES_#999621

Chell Eric Bosson, P.E.
Lic: E-21723 Wisconsin
B.S. ME, Univ. of Minnesota
Laguna Hills, CA
http://www.ae911truth.org/supporters.php?g=_AES_#998559

Chester W. Gearhart, P.E., Retired
Lic: Retired
B.S. Civil Engineering, Univ of Missouri
Kansas City, MO
http://www.ae911truth.org/supporters.php?g=_AES_#999379

Claude Robert Briscoe, P.E.
Lic: Civil Engineer C17546 -- California
BS Engineering, UCLA
Santa Rosa, CA
http://www.ae911truth.org/supporters.php?g=_AES_#998501

Curtiss Lee Palin, P.E.
Lic: Colorado 27315 Professional Engineer exp 2009
M.S. Engineering
Fort Collins, CO
http://www.ae911truth.org/supporters.php?g=_AES_#998958

David E. Cassel, P.E.
Lic: P-5352 Mechanical Engineering exp 2008
B.S. Mechanical Engineering
Oldtown, ID Bruce W. Randall, B.S. M.E. Manufacturing Engineer *
B.S. M.E. - UMass Amherst 1984
Longmeadow, MA
http://www.ae911truth.org/supporters.php?g=_AES_#999386


David G. Huebner, P.E.
Lic: 6201036077 MI Professional Engineer
BSCE
Auburn Hills, MI
http://www.ae911truth.org/supporters.php?g=_AES_#998720

Dennis Henry, P.E.
Lic: 017849 MO
B.S. Civil Engineering
Kansas City, MO
http://www.ae911truth.org/supporters.php?g=_AES_#997431

Dennis J. Kollar, P.E., Structural Engineer
Lic: 34422-6 professional engineer exp 2008
B.S. + Graduate Coursework
West Bend, WI
http://www.ae911truth.org/supporters.php?g=_AES_#999609

Donal Butterfield, RA & PE
Lic: RA11145 NY, PE39888 NY, RA1952 Conn
BA, BCE, MUD
New York, NY
http://www.ae911truth.org/supporters.php?g=_AES_#998723

Donald Meserlian, P.E.
Lic: New Jersey Engineer's License 24GE01507900
M.S.M.E.
N. Caldwell, NJ
http://www.ae911truth.org/supporters.php?g=_AES_#998887

Edward Munyak, P.E.
Lic: Mechanical 16804 Fire Protection 247
BSME Catholic University of America
Los Altos Hills, CA
http://www.ae911truth.org/supporters.php?g=_AES_#999385

Fred Nguyen, P.E.
Lic: New Jersey Professional Engineer 24GE03923300
M.S. Mech. Eng., Stevens Inst. of Tech.
Maplewood, NJ
http://www.ae911truth.org/supporters.php?g=_AES_#999068

J. Marx Ayres, PE, Mechanical Engineer
Lic: 10631 mechanical
BSME
Santa Monica, CA
http://www.ae911truth.org/supporters.php?g=_AES_#999926

Jack Keller, Ph.D., P.E.
Lic: 139070-2202 issued 1961, exp 2009
Logan, UT
http://www.ae911truth.org/supporters.php?g=_AES_#998929

James R. Carr, Ph.D., P.E.(geological engineering,, Professor, Ge
Lic: 007464 Geological Engineer 1987, exp 2008
Reno, NV
http://www.ae911truth.org/supporters.php?g=_AES_#999783

Jeffrey McNabb, P.E. Engineering Consultant
Lic: 10690PE MT
BS & MS Civil Engineering, UMinnesota
Bozeman, MT
http://www.ae911truth.org/supporters.php?g=_AES_#998345

John Franklin, P.E. *
Lubec, ME
http://www.ae911truth.org/supporters.php?g=_AES_#999774

John V. Mizzi, P.E.
Lic: NY Professional Engineer Lic. # 052688
B.E.E.
Poughkeepsie, NY
http://www.ae911truth.org/supporters.php?g=_AES_#998901

John M. Sparnicht, P.E., Civil Engineer, California
Lic: CA license #89504 Civil Engineer, exp 12/31/07
Dayton, NV
http://www.ae911truth.org/supporters.php?g=_AES_#999678

Kamal S. Obeid, SE, PE
Lic: Structural Engineer 2826 CA, Civil Engineer 35214
MSCE, UC Berkeley
Fremont, CA
http://www.ae911truth.org/supporters.php?g=_AES_#998760

L. Alan Pyeatt, P.E.
Lic: C56857 CA (Civil Engineer)
B.S.C.E.
Malibu, CA
http://www.ae911truth.org/supporters.php?g=_AES_#997365

Melissa Allin, P.E.
Lic: 18704 OK
B.S.A.E.
Comanche, OK
http://www.ae911truth.org/supporters.php?g=_AES_#997381

Michael T. Donly, P.E., Structural/Civil Engineer
Lic: New Jersey 24GE04422400
B.S.C.E. N.J. Institute of Technology
Hackensack, NJ
http://www.ae911truth.org/supporters.php?g=_AES_#999081

Michael E. Stephens, P.E.
Lic: OK 20643 exp 2009; AR 11302
B.S., Geological Engineering
Welling, OK
http://www.ae911truth.org/supporters.php?g=_AES_#999437

Mike Maguire, P.E. *
Lic: CA Mechanical Engineer License 29404 exp 2009
MS, Mech/Aero Engineering, UC Davis
Livermore, CA
http://www.ae911truth.org/supporters.php?g=_AES_#999091

Mikos S. Fabersunne, P.E.
Lic: M020644
B.S. Engineering (Chemical), UC Davis
Davis, CA
http://www.ae911truth.org/supporters.php?g=_AES_#997469

Mitchell Scott Stein, P.E.
Lic: env pe #84826
M.S. Civil Eng., Univ. of Texas at Austi
Austin, TX
http://www.ae911truth.org/supporters.php?g=_AES_#999260

Peter D. Morse, P.E., Mechanical Engineer
Lic: Mechanical Engineer #38829 exp 2009
B.S., Mech. Engr., B.A., Journalism
Tucson, AZ
http://www.ae911truth.org/supporters.php?g=_AES_#999664

Scott C. Grainger, PE, Forensic Fire Protection Engineer
Lic: 30031 AZ
BS Civil Engineering
Mesa, AZ
http://www.ae911truth.org/supporters.php?g=_AES_#998535

Ronald H. Brookman, Structural Engineer, PE
Lic: Structural Engineer 3653 CA Civil Engineer 44654 C
B.S. & M.S. Engineering, U.C. Davis
Novato, CA
http://www.ae911truth.org/supporters.php?g=_AES_#997441

And the list goes on there so I can't be fucked copying anymore of te
P.E out of the list of almost 300 now.

Post by Al Dykes
That list is made of the members and consultants to the 9/11
commission and NIST and people that have published research related to
the collapse of the towers.
Many of them have signed their names to teh Popular Mechanics 9/11
report which is a retelling of the NIST
http://www.popularmechanics.com/technology/military_law/1227842.html?...
--
Al Dykes
News is something someone wants to suppress, everything else is advertising.
- Lord Northcliffe, publisher of the Daily Mail

[Ah man]

Post by Al Dykes

Post by Ah man

Post by t***@gmail.com

Post by Midex

Post by RichL
This was posted about six months ago and thoroughly discredited then.
Repeating a lie over and over again doesn't make it true.

lol. "totally discredited then".
Here is the consensus from the experts:www.ae911truth.org
The jury is in. It was a controlled demolition.

Your group of kooks do not make a "consensus", idiot

Qualified professional engineers and architects are "kooks" according
to Zionist troll loser Canberra resident, Chris Textor (aka Tex).
Still waiting for you to find me a comparable list of engineers and
architects who publicly support the NIST Magic Fire explanation.
I'll give you a $1000 if you can find me 20. You won't be able to
find even that many. I'd call 280 to 20 a fairly overwhelming expert
consensus.

Abolhassan Astaneh-Asl, Ph.D., P.E.
Alan Rosa, P.E., S.E.
Allyn Kilsheimer, P.E.
Amit Bandyopadhyay, S.E.
Amy Zelson Mundorff
Anamaria Bonilla, S.E.
Andrew McConnell, S.E.
Andrew Mueller-Lust, S.E.
Andrew Pontecorvo, P.E.
Anthony Kirk US&R Structural Specialist
Anthony W. Chuliver, S.E.
Antoine E. Naaman, Ph.D.
Antranig M. Ouzoonian, P.E.
Arlan Dobson, FEMA Region 2 DAS
August Domel, Ph.D., S.E., P.E.
Bernie Denke US&R Structural Specialist
Bill Cote
Bill Coulbourne, P.E., S.E.
Bob Gray (I.U.O.E.)
Bonnie Manley, P.E., S.E.
Boris Hayda, P.E., S.E.
Brian Lyons, Tully
Brian McElhatten, S.E.
Brian Smith (Col.), Chief Deputy Medical Examiner, Dover AFB
Charles Hirsch, M.D.
Charles J. Carter, AISC
Charles Thornton, P.E.
Charlie Vitchers
Christopher E. Marrion, P.E.
Christopher M. Hewitt, AISC
Chuck Guardia, S.E.
D. Stanton Korista, P.E., S.E.
Dan Doyle (IW 40)
Dan Eschenasy, P.E., S.E.
Dan Koch Jr.
Daniel A. Cuoco, P.E
Daniele Veneziano, P.E.
David Davidowitz, ConEd
David Hoy, S.E.
David Leach, USACE
David M. Parks, ME
David Peraza, P.E., S.E.
David Ranlet
David Schomburg
David Sharp, S.E.
David T. Biggs, P.E.
Dean Koutsoubis, S.E.
Dean Tills, P.E.
Delbert Boring, P.E.
Dennis Clark (IST)
Dennis Dirkmaat, Ph.D.
Dennis Mileti, Ph.D.
Dennis Smith
Dick Posthauer, S.E.
Donald Friedman, P.E.
Donald O. Dusenberry, P.E.
Ed McGinley, P.E.
Ed Plaugher, Chief, Arlington FD
Edward A. Flynn, Arlington Police Chief
Edward Depaola, S.E.
Edward M. DePaola, P.E.
Edward Stinnette, Chief, FCFD
Fahim Sadek, P.E., S.E.
Farid Alfawakhiri Ph.D.
FDNY Battalion Chief Frank Vallebuono
FDNY Captain Anthony Varriale
FDNY Chief Frank Cruthers
FDNY Chief Frank Fellini
FDNY Chief Joseph Callan
FDNY Chief of Operations Daniel Nigro
FDNY Deputy Chief Nick Visconti
FDNY Deputy Chief Peter Hayden
FDNY Firefighter Sam Melisi
Francis J. Lombardi, P.E.
Frank Gayle, Sc.D.
Gary Keith, V.P. NFPA
Gary Steficek, S.E.
Gary Suson
Gary Tokle, Asst. VP, NFPA
George Tamaro, P.E., S.E.
Gerald Haynes, P.E.
Gerald Wellman US&R Structural Specialist
Guy Colonna, P.E., NFPA
Guylene Proulx, Ph.D.
H.S. Lew, P.E., S.E.
Hal Bidlack, Lt. Col. USAF (ret.), Ph.D.
Harold E. Nelson, P.E., FSFP.E.
Harry Martin, AISC
J. David Frost, Ph.D., P.E.
Jack Brown Deputy Chief Loudoun County (Va.) Fire Rescue Department
Jack Messagno, WTC project Manager (Tully)
James A. Rossberg, P.E.
James Chastain US&R Structural Specialist
James H. Fahey, S.E.
James Lord, FSFP.E.
James Milke, Ph.D., P.E.
Jan Szumanski, IUOE
Jason Averill, FSFP.E.
Jeffrey Hartman, S.E.
Jim Abadie, Bovis
Joel Meyerowitz
John Gross, Ph.D., P.E.
John Hodgens, FDNY (ret.)
John J. Zils, P.E., S.E.
John L. Gross, Ph.D., P.E.
John Lekstutis, P.E.
John M. Hanson, Ph.D, P.E.
John McArdle NYPD/ESU (DTC)
John Moran, NYPD/ESU (NTC)
John O'Connell
John Odermatt (NYC OEM)
John Ruddy, P.E., S.E.
John W. Fisher, P.E.
Jon Magnusson, P.E., S.E.
John Ryan, PAPD
Jonathan Barnett, Ph.D
Joo-Eun Lee P.E., S.E.
Joseph C. Gehlen, P.E., S.E.
Jozef Van Dyck, P.E.
Juan Paulo Morla, S.E.
Karl Koch III
Karl Koch IV
Kaspar Willam, P.E., S.E.
Kenneth Holden
Kent Watts
Kevin Brennan, OSHA
Kevin Malley, FDNY (ret.)
Kevin Terry, S.E.
Kurt Gustafson, P.E., S.E.
Larry Keating (IW 40)
Lawrence C. Bank, Ph.D., P.E.
Lawrence Griffis, P.E.
Leo J. Titus, P.E.
Leonard M. Joseph, P.E.
Leslie E. Robertson, P.E., S.E.
Long T. Phan, Ph.D., P.E.
Lou Mendes, P.E., S.E.
Louis Errichiello, S.E.
Manny Velivasakis, P.E.
Mark Blair
Mark Kucera, USACE
Mark Tamaro, P.E
Mark Volpe, IW 40
Marty Corcoran
Matthew G. Yerkey, P.E., S.E.
Merle E. Brander, P.E.
Mete A. Sozen, Ph.D., S.E.
Michael Burton, P.E.
Michael Dallal
Michael Hessheimer, S.E.
Michael Tylk, P.E., S.E.
Mike Banker, FDNY Capt. (SOC)
Mike Marscio, P.E.
Miroslav Sulc,, P.E., S.E.
Mohammed Ettouney
Morgan Hurley, FSFP.E.
Nestor Iwankiw, Ph.D., P.E.
Nick Carcich
Norman Groner, Ph.D.
Pablo Lopez, P.E., S.E.
Paul A. Bosela, Ph.D., P.E.
Paul F. Mlakar, Ph.D., P.E.
Paul Sledzik
Paul Tertell, P.E.
Pete Bakersky
Peter Chipchase, S.E.
Peter Rinaldi, P.E.
Pia Hoffman
Rajani Nair, S.E.
Ramon Gilsanz, P.E., S.E
Randy Lawson
Raul Maestre, P.E., S.E.
Raymond F. Messer, P.E.
Reidar Bjorhovde, Ph.D., P.E
Richard Bukowski P.E., FSFP.E.
Richard G. Gewain, P.E., S.E.
Richard Gann, Ph.D.
Richard Garlock, P.E., S.E.
Richard Kahler US&R Structural Specialist
Robert C. Sinn, P.E., S.E.
Robert F. Duval (NFPA)
Robert Frances US&R Structural Specialist
Robert J. McNamara, P.E., S.E.
Robert Ratay, Ph.D., P.E., S.E.
Robert Shaler, M.D.
Robert Smilowitz, Ph.D., P.E
Robert Solomon, P.E.
Robert Wills, AISC
Ronald Hamburger, P.E., S.E.
Ronald J. LaMere, P.E.
Ronald Rehm, Ph.D.
Ronald Spadafora, FDNY D.A.C
Ruben M. Zallen, P.E.
Russell "Rusty" Dodge Jr, Asst. Chief, Fort Belvoir FD
S. Shyam Sunder, P.E., S.E.
Saw-Teen See, P.E.
Shankar Nair. P.E., S.E.
Shawn Kelly, Arlington County Fire Marshal
Socrates Ioannides, P.E., S.E.
Sonny Scarff
Stan Murphy, P.E.
Stephen Cauffman
Steve Rasweiler, FDNY B.C. (SOC)
Stuart Foltz, P.E.
Terry Sullivan, Bovis
Theodore Galambos, P.E.
Theodore Krauthammer, Ph.D., P.E.
Therese P. McAllister, Ph.D., P.E.
Thomas Hawkins Jr, Chief, AFD
Thomas Schlafly, AISC
Todd Ude, P.E., S.E.
Tom Scarangello, P.E.
Tom Stanton (IST)
Tony Beale, P.E.
Valentine Junker
Venkatesh Kodur, Ph.D., P.E.
Victor Hare, P.E.
Vincent Dunn, FDNY (ret.)
W. Gene Corley, Ph.D., P.E., S.E.
W. Lee Evey
Wallace Miller
William Baker, P.E., S.E
William Grosshandler, Ph.D., ME
William McGuire, P.E.
Willie Quinlan, IW
Zdenek Bazant, Ph.D., S.E.
9/11 Commission & Staff
Thomas H. Kean, Chair
Lee H. Hamilton, Vice Chair
Richard Ben-Veniste
Fred F. Fielding
Jamie S. Gorelick
Slade Gorton
Bob Kerrey
John F. Lehman
Timothy J. Roemer
James R. Thompson
Joanne Accolla
Alexis Albion
Scott Allan
John Azzarello
Caroline Barnes
Warren Bass
Ann Bennett
Mark Bittinger
Madeleine Blot
Antwion Blount
Geoff Brown
Daniel Byman
Dianna Campagna
Sam Caspersen
Melissa Coffey
Lance Cole
Marquittia Coleman
Marco Cordero
Raj De Counsel
George Delgrosso
Gerald L. Dillingham
Thomas Dowling
Steven Dunne
Thomas Eldridge
John Farmer
Alvin Felzenberg
Gordon England
Lorry Fenner
Susan Ginsburg
T. Graham Giusti
Nicole Grandrimo
Doug Greenburg
Barbara Grewe
Elinore Hartz
Len Hawley
Christine Healey
Karen Heitkotter
Walt Hempel
Michael Hurley
Dana Hyde
Michael Jacobson
Bonnie Jenkins
Reginald Johnson
William Johnstone
Stephanie Kaplan
Miles Kara
Janice Kephart-Roberts
Hyon Kim
Christopher Kojm
Katarzyna (Kasia) Kozaczuk
Gordon Lederman
Daniel Leopold
Sarah Linden
Douglas MacEachin
Daniel Marcus
Ernest May
James Miller
Plus at least one person in each of these organizations.
CTL Engineering
D.H. Griffin Wrecking Co. Inc.
DeSimone Consulting Engineers
Dewhurst MacFarlane &Partners
DiSalvo Ericson Engineering
District of Columbia Fire & Rescue
DOD Honor Guard, Pentagon
D'Onofrio Construction
E-4B National Airborne Operations Center crews
Edwards and Kelcey Engineering
Engineering Systems, Inc.
Environmental protection Agency
Exponent Failure Analysis Associates
EYP Mission CriticalFacilities
Fairfax County Fire & Rescue
Falcon 20 crew in PA
Family members who received calls from victims on the planes
FBI Evidence Recovery Teams
Federal Aviation Administration
Federal Bureau of Investigation
Federal Emergency Management Agency
Federal Insurance Co.
FEMA 68-Person Urban Search and Rescue Teams: Arizona Task Force 1,
California Task Force 1,
California Task Force 3,
California Task Force 7,
Colorado Task Force 1,
Fairfax Task Force 1,
Florida Task Force 1,
Florida Task Force 2,
Maryland Task Force 1,
Massachusetts Task Force 1,
Metro Dade/Miami,
Nebraska Task Force 1,
New Mexico Task Force 1,
New York Task Force 1,
Pennsylvania Task Force 1,
Tennessee Task Force 1,
Texas Task Force 1,
Utah Task Force 1,
Virginia Task Force 1,
Virginia Task Force 2,
Washington Task Force 1
FEMA Disaster Field Office
FEMA Emergency Response Team
FEMA Urban Search and Rescue Incident Support Team-Advanced 3
Fire Department of New York
Fort Myer Fire Department
French Urban Search & Rescue Task Force
Friedens Volunteer Fire Department
Gateway Demolition
Gene Code Forensics
Georgia Tech Engineering Dept.
Gilsanz Murray Steficek LLP
GMAC Financing
Goldstein Associates Consulting Engineers
Guy Nordenson Associates
HAKS Engineers
Hampton-Clarke Inc.
HHS National Medical Response Team
HLW International Engineering
Hooversville Rescue Squad.
Hooversville Volunteer Fire Department
Hoy Structural Services
Hughes Associates, Inc
Hugo Neu Schnitzer East
hundreds of ironworkers, some of whom built the WTC
Hundreds of New York City Police Department Detectives
Industrial Risk Insurers
Institute for Civil Infrastructure Systems
International Association of Fire Chiefs
International Union of Operating Engineers Locals 14 & 15
J.R. Harris & Company
Karl Koch Steel Consulting Inc.
KCE Structural Engineers
Koch Skanska
Koutsoubis, Alonso Associates
Laboratory Corp. of America
Lamont-Doherty Earth Observatory
Leslie E. Robertson Associates
LIRo Engineering
Listie Volunteer Fire Company
Lockwood Consulting
M.G. McLaren Engineering
Masonry Society
Mazzocchi Wrecking Inc.
Metal Management Northeast
Metropolitan Airport Authority Fire Unit
Miami-Dade Urban Search & Rescue
Military District of Washington Search & Rescue Team
Montgomery County Fire & Rescue
Mueser Rutledge Consulting Engineers
Murray Engineering
Myriad Genetic Laboratories Inc.
National Center for Biotechnology Informatics
National Commission on Terrorist Attacks Upon the United States
National Council of Structural Engineers Associations
National Disaster Medical System
National Emergency Numbering Association
National Fire Protection Association
National Guard in D.C., New York, and Pennsylvania
National Institute of Standards and Technology (NIST)
National Institutes of Health Human Genome Research Institute
National Law Enforcement and Security Institute
National Military Command Center
National Reconnaissance Office
National Response Center
National Science Foundation Division of Civil and Mechanical Systems
National Security Agency
National Transportation Safety Board
National Wrecking
Natural Hazards Research and Applications Information Center
New Jersey State Police
New York City Department of Buildings WTC Task Force
New York City Department of Design and Construction
New York City Department of Environmental Protection
New York City Office of Emergency Management
New York City Office of the Chief Medical Examiner
New York City Police Department Aviation Unit
New York City Police Department Emergency Services Unit
New York Daily News
New York Flight Control Center
New York Newsday
New York Port Authority Construction Board
New York Port Authority Police
New York State Emergency Management Office
New York State Police Forensic Services
New York Times
North American Aerospace Defense Command
Northeast Air Defense Sector Commanders and crew
Numerous bomb-sniffing dogs
Numerous Forensic Anthropologists
Numerous Forensic Dentists
Numerous Forensic Pathologists
Numerous Forensic Radiologists
NuStats
Occupational Safety and Health Administration
Office of Emergency Preparedness
Office of Strategic Services
Orchid Cellmark
Parsons Brinckerhoff Engineering
Pennsylvania Department of Environmental Protection
Pennsylvania Department of Health and Human Services
Pennsylvania Region 13 Metropolitan Medical Response Group
Pennsylvania State Funeral Directors Association
Pennsylvania State Police
Pentagon Defense Protective Service
Pentagon Helicopter Crash Response Team
Pentagon Medical Staff
Pentagon Renovation Team
Phillips & Jordan, Inc.
Port of New York and New Jersey Authority
Pro-Safety Services
Protec
Public Entity Risk Institute
Purdue University Engineering Dept.
Robert Silman Associates Structural Engineers
Rolf Jensen & Associates, Inc
Rosenwasser/Grossman Consulting Engineers
Royal SunAlliance/Royal Indemnity
SACE Prime Power Assessment Teams
SACE Structural Safety Engineers and Debris Planning and Response Teams
Salvation Army Disaster Services
several EPA Hazmat Teams
several FBI Hazmat Teams
several Federal Disaster Medical Assistance Teams
several Federal Disaster Mortuary (DMORT) Teams
Severud Associates Consulting Engineers
Shanksville Volunteer Fire Company
Silverstein Properties
Simpson Gumpertz & Heger Engineers
Skidmore, Owings & Merrill LLP
Skilling Ward Magnusson Barkshire
Society of Fire Protection Engineers
Somerset Ambulance Association
Somerset County Coroner's Office
Somerset County Emergency Management Agency
Somerset Volunteer Fire Department
St. Paul/Travelers Insurance
State of Pennsylvania Emergency Management Agency
Stoystown Volunteer Fire Company
Structural Engineering Institute of the American Society of Civil Engineers (SEI/ASCE)
Structural Engineers Association of New York
Superstructures Engineering
Swiss Re America Insurance
Telephone operators who took calls from passengers in the hijacked planes
Teng & Associates
Thornton-Tomasetti Group, Inc.
TIG Insurance
Tokio Marine & Fire
Transportation Safety Administration
Tully Construction
Twin City Fire Insurance
Tylk Gustafson Reckers Wilson Andrews Engineering
U.S. Army Corps of Engineers
Underwriters Laboratories
Union Wrecking
United Airlines
United States Air National Guard
United States Fire Administration
United States Secret Service
United Steelworkers of America
University of Sheffield Fire Engineering Research
US Army Reserves of Virginia Beach Fairfax County and Montgomery County
US Army.s Communications-Electronics Command
US Department of Defense
US Department of Justice
US Department of State
Virginia Beach Fire Department
Virginia Department of Emergency Management
Virginia State Police
Vollmer Associates Engineers
Washington Post
Weeks Marine
Weidlinger Associates
Weiskopf & Pickworth Engineering
Westmoreland County Emergency Management Agency
Whitney Contracting
Willis Group Holdings
WJE Structural Engineers
Worcester Polytechnic Institute
World Trade Center security staff
XL Insurance
Yonkers Contracting
York International
Zurich Financial
Zurich Re Risk Engineering
Conspiracists: are these people liars, dupes, or shills?

The 9/11 Commission didn't investigate the collapse of the towers.

So are you a liar? Why are you feigning that the list of names of the
9/11 COmmission is anything to do with the collapse of the towers?

NIST didn't investgate the collapse of the towers. So listing names
associated just shows you that all of these people didn't investigate
the collapse of the towers.

Post by Al Dykes
--
Al Dykes
News is something someone wants to suppress, everything else is advertising.
- Lord Northcliffe, publisher of the Daily Mail

[Ah man]

Post by Al Dykes

Post by Ah man

Post by t***@gmail.com

Post by Midex

Post by RichL
This was posted about six months ago and thoroughly discredited then.
Repeating a lie over and over again doesn't make it true.

lol. "totally discredited then".
Here is the consensus from the experts:www.ae911truth.org
The jury is in. It was a controlled demolition.

Your group of kooks do not make a "consensus", idiot

Qualified professional engineers and architects are "kooks" according
to Zionist troll loser Canberra resident, Chris Textor (aka Tex).
Still waiting for you to find me a comparable list of engineers and
architects who publicly support the NIST Magic Fire explanation.
I'll give you a $1000 if you can find me 20. You won't be able to
find even that many. I'd call 280 to 20 a fairly overwhelming expert
consensus.

Abolhassan Astaneh-Asl, Ph.D., P.E.
Alan Rosa, P.E., S.E.
Allyn Kilsheimer, P.E.
Amit Bandyopadhyay, S.E.
Amy Zelson Mundorff
Anamaria Bonilla, S.E.
Andrew McConnell, S.E.
Andrew Mueller-Lust, S.E.
Andrew Pontecorvo, P.E.
Anthony Kirk US&R Structural Specialist
Anthony W. Chuliver, S.E.
Antoine E. Naaman, Ph.D.
Antranig M. Ouzoonian, P.E.
Arlan Dobson, FEMA Region 2 DAS
August Domel, Ph.D., S.E., P.E.
Bernie Denke US&R Structural Specialist
Bill Cote
Bill Coulbourne, P.E., S.E.
Bob Gray (I.U.O.E.)
Bonnie Manley, P.E., S.E.
Boris Hayda, P.E., S.E.
Brian Lyons, Tully
Brian McElhatten, S.E.
Brian Smith (Col.), Chief Deputy Medical Examiner, Dover AFB
Charles Hirsch, M.D.
Charles J. Carter, AISC
Charles Thornton, P.E.
Charlie Vitchers
Christopher E. Marrion, P.E.
Christopher M. Hewitt, AISC
Chuck Guardia, S.E.
D. Stanton Korista, P.E., S.E.
Dan Doyle (IW 40)
Dan Eschenasy, P.E., S.E.
Dan Koch Jr.
Daniel A. Cuoco, P.E
Daniele Veneziano, P.E.
David Davidowitz, ConEd
David Hoy, S.E.
David Leach, USACE
David M. Parks, ME
David Peraza, P.E., S.E.
David Ranlet
David Schomburg
David Sharp, S.E.
David T. Biggs, P.E.
Dean Koutsoubis, S.E.
Dean Tills, P.E.
Delbert Boring, P.E.
Dennis Clark (IST)
Dennis Dirkmaat, Ph.D.
Dennis Mileti, Ph.D.
Dennis Smith
Dick Posthauer, S.E.
Donald Friedman, P.E.
Donald O. Dusenberry, P.E.
Ed McGinley, P.E.
Ed Plaugher, Chief, Arlington FD
Edward A. Flynn, Arlington Police Chief
Edward Depaola, S.E.
Edward M. DePaola, P.E.
Edward Stinnette, Chief, FCFD
Fahim Sadek, P.E., S.E.
Farid Alfawakhiri Ph.D.
FDNY Battalion Chief Frank Vallebuono
FDNY Captain Anthony Varriale
FDNY Chief Frank Cruthers
FDNY Chief Frank Fellini
FDNY Chief Joseph Callan
FDNY Chief of Operations Daniel Nigro
FDNY Deputy Chief Nick Visconti
FDNY Deputy Chief Peter Hayden
FDNY Firefighter Sam Melisi
Francis J. Lombardi, P.E.
Frank Gayle, Sc.D.
Gary Keith, V.P. NFPA
Gary Steficek, S.E.
Gary Suson
Gary Tokle, Asst. VP, NFPA
George Tamaro, P.E., S.E.
Gerald Haynes, P.E.
Gerald Wellman US&R Structural Specialist
Guy Colonna, P.E., NFPA
Guylene Proulx, Ph.D.
H.S. Lew, P.E., S.E.
Hal Bidlack, Lt. Col. USAF (ret.), Ph.D.
Harold E. Nelson, P.E., FSFP.E.
Harry Martin, AISC
J. David Frost, Ph.D., P.E.
Jack Brown Deputy Chief Loudoun County (Va.) Fire Rescue Department
Jack Messagno, WTC project Manager (Tully)
James A. Rossberg, P.E.
James Chastain US&R Structural Specialist
James H. Fahey, S.E.
James Lord, FSFP.E.
James Milke, Ph.D., P.E.
Jan Szumanski, IUOE
Jason Averill, FSFP.E.
Jeffrey Hartman, S.E.
Jim Abadie, Bovis
Joel Meyerowitz
John Gross, Ph.D., P.E.
John Hodgens, FDNY (ret.)
John J. Zils, P.E., S.E.
John L. Gross, Ph.D., P.E.
John Lekstutis, P.E.
John M. Hanson, Ph.D, P.E.
John McArdle NYPD/ESU (DTC)
John Moran, NYPD/ESU (NTC)
John O'Connell
John Odermatt (NYC OEM)
John Ruddy, P.E., S.E.
John W. Fisher, P.E.
Jon Magnusson, P.E., S.E.
John Ryan, PAPD
Jonathan Barnett, Ph.D
Joo-Eun Lee P.E., S.E.
Joseph C. Gehlen, P.E., S.E.
Jozef Van Dyck, P.E.
Juan Paulo Morla, S.E.
Karl Koch III
Karl Koch IV
Kaspar Willam, P.E., S.E.
Kenneth Holden
Kent Watts
Kevin Brennan, OSHA
Kevin Malley, FDNY (ret.)
Kevin Terry, S.E.
Kurt Gustafson, P.E., S.E.
Larry Keating (IW 40)
Lawrence C. Bank, Ph.D., P.E.
Lawrence Griffis, P.E.
Leo J. Titus, P.E.
Leonard M. Joseph, P.E.
Leslie E. Robertson, P.E., S.E.
Long T. Phan, Ph.D., P.E.
Lou Mendes, P.E., S.E.
Louis Errichiello, S.E.
Manny Velivasakis, P.E.
Mark Blair
Mark Kucera, USACE
Mark Tamaro, P.E
Mark Volpe, IW 40
Marty Corcoran
Matthew G. Yerkey, P.E., S.E.
Merle E. Brander, P.E.
Mete A. Sozen, Ph.D., S.E.
Michael Burton, P.E.
Michael Dallal
Michael Hessheimer, S.E.
Michael Tylk, P.E., S.E.
Mike Banker, FDNY Capt. (SOC)
Mike Marscio, P.E.
Miroslav Sulc,, P.E., S.E.
Mohammed Ettouney
Morgan Hurley, FSFP.E.
Nestor Iwankiw, Ph.D., P.E.
Nick Carcich
Norman Groner, Ph.D.
Pablo Lopez, P.E., S.E.
Paul A. Bosela, Ph.D., P.E.
Paul F. Mlakar, Ph.D., P.E.
Paul Sledzik
Paul Tertell, P.E.
Pete Bakersky
Peter Chipchase, S.E.
Peter Rinaldi, P.E.
Pia Hoffman
Rajani Nair, S.E.
Ramon Gilsanz, P.E., S.E
Randy Lawson
Raul Maestre, P.E., S.E.
Raymond F. Messer, P.E.
Reidar Bjorhovde, Ph.D., P.E
Richard Bukowski P.E., FSFP.E.
Richard G. Gewain, P.E., S.E.
Richard Gann, Ph.D.
Richard Garlock, P.E., S.E.
Richard Kahler US&R Structural Specialist
Robert C. Sinn, P.E., S.E.
Robert F. Duval (NFPA)
Robert Frances US&R Structural Specialist
Robert J. McNamara, P.E., S.E.
Robert Ratay, Ph.D., P.E., S.E.
Robert Shaler, M.D.
Robert Smilowitz, Ph.D., P.E
Robert Solomon, P.E.
Robert Wills, AISC
Ronald Hamburger, P.E., S.E.
Ronald J. LaMere, P.E.
Ronald Rehm, Ph.D.
Ronald Spadafora, FDNY D.A.C
Ruben M. Zallen, P.E.
Russell "Rusty" Dodge Jr, Asst. Chief, Fort Belvoir FD
S. Shyam Sunder, P.E., S.E.
Saw-Teen See, P.E.
Shankar Nair. P.E., S.E.
Shawn Kelly, Arlington County Fire Marshal
Socrates Ioannides, P.E., S.E.
Sonny Scarff
Stan Murphy, P.E.
Stephen Cauffman
Steve Rasweiler, FDNY B.C. (SOC)
Stuart Foltz, P.E.
Terry Sullivan, Bovis
Theodore Galambos, P.E.
Theodore Krauthammer, Ph.D., P.E.
Therese P. McAllister, Ph.D., P.E.
Thomas Hawkins Jr, Chief, AFD
Thomas Schlafly, AISC
Todd Ude, P.E., S.E.
Tom Scarangello, P.E.
Tom Stanton (IST)
Tony Beale, P.E.
Valentine Junker
Venkatesh Kodur, Ph.D., P.E.
Victor Hare, P.E.
Vincent Dunn, FDNY (ret.)
W. Gene Corley, Ph.D., P.E., S.E.
W. Lee Evey
Wallace Miller
William Baker, P.E., S.E
William Grosshandler, Ph.D., ME
William McGuire, P.E.
Willie Quinlan, IW
Zdenek Bazant, Ph.D., S.E.
9/11 Commission & Staff
Thomas H. Kean, Chair
Lee H. Hamilton, Vice Chair
Richard Ben-Veniste
Fred F. Fielding
Jamie S. Gorelick
Slade Gorton
Bob Kerrey
John F. Lehman
Timothy J. Roemer
James R. Thompson
Joanne Accolla
Alexis Albion
Scott Allan
John Azzarello
Caroline Barnes
Warren Bass
Ann Bennett
Mark Bittinger
Madeleine Blot
Antwion Blount
Geoff Brown
Daniel Byman
Dianna Campagna
Sam Caspersen
Melissa Coffey
Lance Cole
Marquittia Coleman
Marco Cordero
Raj De Counsel
George Delgrosso
Gerald L. Dillingham
Thomas Dowling
Steven Dunne
Thomas Eldridge
John Farmer
Alvin Felzenberg
Gordon England
Lorry Fenner
Susan Ginsburg
T. Graham Giusti
Nicole Grandrimo
Doug Greenburg
Barbara Grewe
Elinore Hartz
Len Hawley
Christine Healey
Karen Heitkotter
Walt Hempel
Michael Hurley
Dana Hyde
Michael Jacobson
Bonnie Jenkins
Reginald Johnson
William Johnstone
Stephanie Kaplan
Miles Kara
Janice Kephart-Roberts
Hyon Kim
Christopher Kojm
Katarzyna (Kasia) Kozaczuk
Gordon Lederman
Daniel Leopold
Sarah Linden
Douglas MacEachin
Daniel Marcus
Ernest May
James Miller
Plus at least one person in each of these organizations.
CTL Engineering
D.H. Griffin Wrecking Co. Inc.
DeSimone Consulting Engineers
Dewhurst MacFarlane &Partners
DiSalvo Ericson Engineering
District of Columbia Fire & Rescue
DOD Honor Guard, Pentagon
D'Onofrio Construction
E-4B National Airborne Operations Center crews
Edwards and Kelcey Engineering
Engineering Systems, Inc.
Environmental protection Agency
Exponent Failure Analysis Associates
EYP Mission CriticalFacilities
Fairfax County Fire & Rescue
Falcon 20 crew in PA
Family members who received calls from victims on the planes
FBI Evidence Recovery Teams
Federal Aviation Administration
Federal Bureau of Investigation
Federal Emergency Management Agency
Federal Insurance Co.
FEMA 68-Person Urban Search and Rescue Teams: Arizona Task Force 1,
California Task Force 1,
California Task Force 3,
California Task Force 7,
Colorado Task Force 1,
Fairfax Task Force 1,
Florida Task Force 1,
Florida Task Force 2,
Maryland Task Force 1,
Massachusetts Task Force 1,
Metro Dade/Miami,
Nebraska Task Force 1,
New Mexico Task Force 1,
New York Task Force 1,
Pennsylvania Task Force 1,
Tennessee Task Force 1,
Texas Task Force 1,
Utah Task Force 1,
Virginia Task Force 1,
Virginia Task Force 2,
Washington Task Force 1
FEMA Disaster Field Office
FEMA Emergency Response Team
FEMA Urban Search and Rescue Incident Support Team-Advanced 3
Fire Department of New York
Fort Myer Fire Department
French Urban Search & Rescue Task Force
Friedens Volunteer Fire Department
Gateway Demolition
Gene Code Forensics
Georgia Tech Engineering Dept.
Gilsanz Murray Steficek LLP
GMAC Financing
Goldstein Associates Consulting Engineers
Guy Nordenson Associates
HAKS Engineers
Hampton-Clarke Inc.
HHS National Medical Response Team
HLW International Engineering
Hooversville Rescue Squad.
Hooversville Volunteer Fire Department
Hoy Structural Services
Hughes Associates, Inc
Hugo Neu Schnitzer East
hundreds of ironworkers, some of whom built the WTC
Hundreds of New York City Police Department Detectives
Industrial Risk Insurers
Institute for Civil Infrastructure Systems
International Association of Fire Chiefs
International Union of Operating Engineers Locals 14 & 15
J.R. Harris & Company
Karl Koch Steel Consulting Inc.
KCE Structural Engineers
Koch Skanska
Koutsoubis, Alonso Associates
Laboratory Corp. of America
Lamont-Doherty Earth Observatory
Leslie E. Robertson Associates
LIRo Engineering
Listie Volunteer Fire Company
Lockwood Consulting
M.G. McLaren Engineering
Masonry Society
Mazzocchi Wrecking Inc.
Metal Management Northeast
Metropolitan Airport Authority Fire Unit
Miami-Dade Urban Search & Rescue
Military District of Washington Search & Rescue Team
Montgomery County Fire & Rescue
Mueser Rutledge Consulting Engineers
Murray Engineering
Myriad Genetic Laboratories Inc.
National Center for Biotechnology Informatics
National Commission on Terrorist Attacks Upon the United States
National Council of Structural Engineers Associations
National Disaster Medical System
National Emergency Numbering Association
National Fire Protection Association
National Guard in D.C., New York, and Pennsylvania
National Institute of Standards and Technology (NIST)
National Institutes of Health Human Genome Research Institute
National Law Enforcement and Security Institute
National Military Command Center
National Reconnaissance Office
National Response Center
National Science Foundation Division of Civil and Mechanical Systems
National Security Agency
National Transportation Safety Board
National Wrecking
Natural Hazards Research and Applications Information Center
New Jersey State Police
New York City Department of Buildings WTC Task Force
New York City Department of Design and Construction
New York City Department of Environmental Protection
New York City Office of Emergency Management
New York City Office of the Chief Medical Examiner
New York City Police Department Aviation Unit
New York City Police Department Emergency Services Unit
New York Daily News
New York Flight Control Center
New York Newsday
New York Port Authority Construction Board
New York Port Authority Police
New York State Emergency Management Office
New York State Police Forensic Services
New York Times
North American Aerospace Defense Command
Northeast Air Defense Sector Commanders and crew
Numerous bomb-sniffing dogs
Numerous Forensic Anthropologists
Numerous Forensic Dentists
Numerous Forensic Pathologists
Numerous Forensic Radiologists
NuStats
Occupational Safety and Health Administration
Office of Emergency Preparedness
Office of Strategic Services
Orchid Cellmark
Parsons Brinckerhoff Engineering
Pennsylvania Department of Environmental Protection
Pennsylvania Department of Health and Human Services
Pennsylvania Region 13 Metropolitan Medical Response Group
Pennsylvania State Funeral Directors Association
Pennsylvania State Police
Pentagon Defense Protective Service
Pentagon Helicopter Crash Response Team
Pentagon Medical Staff
Pentagon Renovation Team
Phillips & Jordan, Inc.
Port of New York and New Jersey Authority
Pro-Safety Services
Protec
Public Entity Risk Institute
Purdue University Engineering Dept.
Robert Silman Associates Structural Engineers
Rolf Jensen & Associates, Inc
Rosenwasser/Grossman Consulting Engineers
Royal SunAlliance/Royal Indemnity
SACE Prime Power Assessment Teams
SACE Structural Safety Engineers and Debris Planning and Response Teams
Salvation Army Disaster Services
several EPA Hazmat Teams
several FBI Hazmat Teams
several Federal Disaster Medical Assistance Teams
several Federal Disaster Mortuary (DMORT) Teams
Severud Associates Consulting Engineers
Shanksville Volunteer Fire Company
Silverstein Properties
Simpson Gumpertz & Heger Engineers
Skidmore, Owings & Merrill LLP
Skilling Ward Magnusson Barkshire
Society of Fire Protection Engineers
Somerset Ambulance Association
Somerset County Coroner's Office
Somerset County Emergency Management Agency
Somerset Volunteer Fire Department
St. Paul/Travelers Insurance
State of Pennsylvania Emergency Management Agency
Stoystown Volunteer Fire Company
Structural Engineering Institute of the American Society of Civil Engineers (SEI/ASCE)
Structural Engineers Association of New York
Superstructures Engineering
Swiss Re America Insurance
Telephone operators who took calls from passengers in the hijacked planes
Teng & Associates
Thornton-Tomasetti Group, Inc.
TIG Insurance
Tokio Marine & Fire
Transportation Safety Administration
Tully Construction
Twin City Fire Insurance
Tylk Gustafson Reckers Wilson Andrews Engineering
U.S. Army Corps of Engineers
Underwriters Laboratories
Union Wrecking
United Airlines
United States Air National Guard
United States Fire Administration
United States Secret Service
United Steelworkers of America
University of Sheffield Fire Engineering Research
US Army Reserves of Virginia Beach Fairfax County and Montgomery County
US Army.s Communications-Electronics Command
US Department of Defense
US Department of Justice
US Department of State
Virginia Beach Fire Department
Virginia Department of Emergency Management
Virginia State Police
Vollmer Associates Engineers
Washington Post
Weeks Marine
Weidlinger Associates
Weiskopf & Pickworth Engineering
Westmoreland County Emergency Management Agency
Whitney Contracting
Willis Group Holdings
WJE Structural Engineers
Worcester Polytechnic Institute
World Trade Center security staff
XL Insurance
Yonkers Contracting
York International
Zurich Financial
Zurich Re Risk Engineering
Conspiracists: are these people liars, dupes, or shills?
--
Al Dykes
News is something someone wants to suppress, everything else is advertising.
- Lord Northcliffe, publisher of the Daily Mail

Hang on, here you are calling "Conspiracists" (whatever the fuck that
is) liars dupes or shills, and then you are quoting Lord Northcliffe
who admits that the Dailey Mail doesn't contain any "news" and is
solely PROPAGANDA. Someone else is quoted as having said that
actually.

Who is behind CONSPIRING the propaganda hey FUCKSTIK? Contradict
yourself in one paragraph.

Here are some more quotes about the mainstream media cabal for you:

"The Central Intelligence Agency owns everyone of any significance in
the major media."
--William Colby, former CIA Director, quoted by Dave Mcgowan,
Derailing Democracy

"Our job is to give people not what they want, but what we decide they
ought to have."
-- Richard Salent, Former President CBS News.

"News is what someone wants to suppress. Everything else is
advertising".
former NBC news President Rubin Frank


"You could get a journalist cheaper than a good call girl, for a
couple hundred dollars a month."
--CIA operative, discussing the availability and prices of journalists
willing to peddle CIA propaganda and cover stories. Katherine the
Great, by Deborah Davis

"There is quite an incredible spread of relationships. You don't need
to manipulate Time magazine, for example, because there are [Central
Intelligence] Agency people at the management level."
--William B. Bader, former CIA intelligence officer, briefing members
of the Senate Intelligence Committee, The CIA and the Media, by Carl
Bernstein

"The Agency's relationship with [The New York] Times was by far its
most valuable among newspapers, according to CIA officials. [It was]
general Times policy ... to provide assistance to the CIA whenever
possible."
--The CIA and the Media, by Carl Bernstein

"Senator William Proxmire has pegged the number of employees of the
federal intelligence community at 148,000 ... though Proxmire's number
is itself a conservative one. The "intelligence community" is
officially defined as including only those organizations that are
members of the U.S. Intelligence Board (USIB); a dozen other agencies,
charged with both foreign and domestic intelligence chores, are not
encompassed by the term.... The number of intelligence workers
employed by the federal government is not 148,000, but some
undetermined multiple of that number."
--Jim Hougan, Spooks

"For some time I have been disturbed by the way the CIA has been
diverted from its original assignment. It has become an operational
and at times a policy-making arm of the government.... I never had any
thought that when I set up the CIA that it would be injected into
peacetime cloak and dagger operations."
--former President Harry Truman, in a letter to the Washington Post,
one month after the JFK assassination, December 21, 1963

Geeewhiz Al Dykes. I guess there are NO CONSPIRACIES hey? Fuckwit.

Here, 9/11 was the murder of 3000 people. Have a look here at the
conspiracy behind the murder of 1 million Iraqis:

Geeewhiz Al Dykes, looks like they lied to murder 1 million Iraqis.
And you think they wouldn't do 9/11?

Fucking naive fool you are. Or are you a little smutty JEW BOY?

[Ah man]

The LIST below isn't a list of engineers and architects who support
NIST's explanation for the collapse of the towers.
For example, " Brian Smith (Col.), Chief Deputy Medical Examiner,
Dover AFB"

So who is the fraud we see Al Dykes? Yep, as always, YOU.

And further, many of the engineers cited in the below list may have
been consulted on any particular matter of engineers not specifically
regarding what THEY THINGK brought down the towers. Further the
questions they may have been consulted on may not have even
specifically revealed the intended usage.

Now I will say it again: Here are now 290 (and growing rapidly)
independent "nothing-to-gain-everything-to-lose" professional degreed
engineers and architects who have made personal statements PUBLICLY
specifically stating their conclusions on having reviewed the evidence
of the collapses: IT MUST HAVE BEEN DONE WITH EXPLOSIVES.

Post by Al Dykes

Post by Ah man

Post by t***@gmail.com

Post by Midex

Post by RichL
This was posted about six months ago and thoroughly discredited then.
Repeating a lie over and over again doesn't make it true.

lol. "totally discredited then".
Here is the consensus from the experts:www.ae911truth.org
The jury is in. It was a controlled demolition.

Your group of kooks do not make a "consensus", idiot

Qualified professional engineers and architects are "kooks" according
to Zionist troll loser Canberra resident, Chris Textor (aka Tex).
Still waiting for you to find me a comparable list of engineers and
architects who publicly support the NIST Magic Fire explanation.
I'll give you a $1000 if you can find me 20. You won't be able to
find even that many. I'd call 280 to 20 a fairly overwhelming expert
consensus.

Abolhassan Astaneh-Asl, Ph.D., P.E.
Alan Rosa, P.E., S.E.
Allyn Kilsheimer, P.E.
Amit Bandyopadhyay, S.E.
Amy Zelson Mundorff
Anamaria Bonilla, S.E.
Andrew McConnell, S.E.
Andrew Mueller-Lust, S.E.
Andrew Pontecorvo, P.E.
Anthony Kirk US&R Structural Specialist
Anthony W. Chuliver, S.E.
Antoine E. Naaman, Ph.D.
Antranig M. Ouzoonian, P.E.
Arlan Dobson, FEMA Region 2 DAS
August Domel, Ph.D., S.E., P.E.
Bernie Denke US&R Structural Specialist
Bill Cote
Bill Coulbourne, P.E., S.E.
Bob Gray (I.U.O.E.)
Bonnie Manley, P.E., S.E.
Boris Hayda, P.E., S.E.
Brian Lyons, Tully
Brian McElhatten, S.E.
Brian Smith (Col.), Chief Deputy Medical Examiner, Dover AFB
Charles Hirsch, M.D.
Charles J. Carter, AISC
Charles Thornton, P.E.
Charlie Vitchers
Christopher E. Marrion, P.E.
Christopher M. Hewitt, AISC
Chuck Guardia, S.E.
D. Stanton Korista, P.E., S.E.
Dan Doyle (IW 40)
Dan Eschenasy, P.E., S.E.
Dan Koch Jr.
Daniel A. Cuoco, P.E
Daniele Veneziano, P.E.
David Davidowitz, ConEd
David Hoy, S.E.
David Leach, USACE
David M. Parks, ME
David Peraza, P.E., S.E.
David Ranlet
David Schomburg
David Sharp, S.E.
David T. Biggs, P.E.
Dean Koutsoubis, S.E.
Dean Tills, P.E.
Delbert Boring, P.E.
Dennis Clark (IST)
Dennis Dirkmaat, Ph.D.
Dennis Mileti, Ph.D.
Dennis Smith
Dick Posthauer, S.E.
Donald Friedman, P.E.
Donald O. Dusenberry, P.E.
Ed McGinley, P.E.
Ed Plaugher, Chief, Arlington FD
Edward A. Flynn, Arlington Police Chief
Edward Depaola, S.E.
Edward M. DePaola, P.E.
Edward Stinnette, Chief, FCFD
Fahim Sadek, P.E., S.E.
Farid Alfawakhiri Ph.D.
FDNY Battalion Chief Frank Vallebuono
FDNY Captain Anthony Varriale
FDNY Chief Frank Cruthers
FDNY Chief Frank Fellini
FDNY Chief Joseph Callan
FDNY Chief of Operations Daniel Nigro
FDNY Deputy Chief Nick Visconti
FDNY Deputy Chief Peter Hayden
FDNY Firefighter Sam Melisi
Francis J. Lombardi, P.E.
Frank Gayle, Sc.D.
Gary Keith, V.P. NFPA
Gary Steficek, S.E.
Gary Suson
Gary Tokle, Asst. VP, NFPA
George Tamaro, P.E., S.E.
Gerald Haynes, P.E.
Gerald Wellman US&R Structural Specialist
Guy Colonna, P.E., NFPA
Guylene Proulx, Ph.D.
H.S. Lew, P.E., S.E.
Hal Bidlack, Lt. Col. USAF (ret.), Ph.D.
Harold E. Nelson, P.E., FSFP.E.
Harry Martin, AISC
J. David Frost, Ph.D., P.E.
Jack Brown Deputy Chief Loudoun County (Va.) Fire Rescue Department
Jack Messagno, WTC project Manager (Tully)
James A. Rossberg, P.E.
James Chastain US&R Structural Specialist
James H. Fahey, S.E.
James Lord, FSFP.E.
James Milke, Ph.D., P.E.
Jan Szumanski, IUOE
Jason Averill, FSFP.E.
Jeffrey Hartman, S.E.
Jim Abadie, Bovis
Joel Meyerowitz
John Gross, Ph.D., P.E.
John Hodgens, FDNY (ret.)
John J. Zils, P.E., S.E.
John L. Gross, Ph.D., P.E.
John Lekstutis, P.E.
John M. Hanson, Ph.D, P.E.
John McArdle NYPD/ESU (DTC)
John Moran, NYPD/ESU (NTC)
John O'Connell
John Odermatt (NYC OEM)
John Ruddy, P.E., S.E.
John W. Fisher, P.E.
Jon Magnusson, P.E., S.E.
John Ryan, PAPD
Jonathan Barnett, Ph.D
Joo-Eun Lee P.E., S.E.
Joseph C. Gehlen, P.E., S.E.
Jozef Van Dyck, P.E.
Juan Paulo Morla, S.E.
Karl Koch III
Karl Koch IV
Kaspar Willam, P.E., S.E.
Kenneth Holden
Kent Watts
Kevin Brennan, OSHA
Kevin Malley, FDNY (ret.)
Kevin Terry, S.E.
Kurt Gustafson, P.E., S.E.
Larry Keating (IW 40)
Lawrence C. Bank, Ph.D., P.E.
Lawrence Griffis, P.E.
Leo J. Titus, P.E.
Leonard M. Joseph, P.E.
Leslie E. Robertson, P.E., S.E.
Long T. Phan, Ph.D., P.E.
Lou Mendes, P.E., S.E.
Louis Errichiello, S.E.
Manny Velivasakis, P.E.
Mark Blair
Mark Kucera, USACE
Mark Tamaro, P.E
Mark Volpe, IW 40
Marty Corcoran
Matthew G. Yerkey, P.E., S.E.
Merle E. Brander, P.E.
Mete A. Sozen, Ph.D., S.E.
Michael Burton, P.E.
Michael Dallal
Michael Hessheimer, S.E.
Michael Tylk, P.E., S.E.
Mike Banker, FDNY Capt. (SOC)
Mike Marscio, P.E.
Miroslav Sulc,, P.E., S.E.
Mohammed Ettouney
Morgan Hurley, FSFP.E.
Nestor Iwankiw, Ph.D., P.E.
Nick Carcich
Norman Groner, Ph.D.
Pablo Lopez, P.E., S.E.
Paul A. Bosela, Ph.D., P.E.
Paul F. Mlakar, Ph.D., P.E.
Paul Sledzik
Paul Tertell, P.E.
Pete Bakersky
Peter Chipchase, S.E.
Peter Rinaldi, P.E.
Pia Hoffman
Rajani Nair, S.E.
Ramon Gilsanz, P.E., S.E
Randy Lawson
Raul Maestre, P.E., S.E.
Raymond F. Messer, P.E.
Reidar Bjorhovde, Ph.D., P.E
Richard Bukowski P.E., FSFP.E.
Richard G. Gewain, P.E., S.E.
Richard Gann, Ph.D.
Richard Garlock, P.E., S.E.
Richard Kahler US&R Structural Specialist
Robert C. Sinn, P.E., S.E.
Robert F. Duval (NFPA)
Robert Frances US&R Structural Specialist
Robert J. McNamara, P.E., S.E.
Robert Ratay, Ph.D., P.E., S.E.
Robert Shaler, M.D.
Robert Smilowitz, Ph.D., P.E
Robert Solomon, P.E.
Robert Wills, AISC
Ronald Hamburger, P.E., S.E.
Ronald J. LaMere, P.E.
Ronald Rehm, Ph.D.
Ronald Spadafora, FDNY D.A.C
Ruben M. Zallen, P.E.
Russell "Rusty" Dodge Jr, Asst. Chief, Fort Belvoir FD
S. Shyam Sunder, P.E., S.E.
Saw-Teen See, P.E.
Shankar Nair. P.E., S.E.
Shawn Kelly, Arlington County Fire Marshal
Socrates Ioannides, P.E., S.E.
Sonny Scarff
Stan Murphy, P.E.
Stephen Cauffman
Steve Rasweiler, FDNY B.C. (SOC)
Stuart Foltz, P.E.
Terry Sullivan, Bovis
Theodore Galambos, P.E.
Theodore Krauthammer, Ph.D., P.E.
Therese P. McAllister, Ph.D., P.E.
Thomas Hawkins Jr, Chief, AFD
Thomas Schlafly, AISC
Todd Ude, P.E., S.E.
Tom Scarangello, P.E.
Tom Stanton (IST)
Tony Beale, P.E.
Valentine Junker
Venkatesh Kodur, Ph.D., P.E.
Victor Hare, P.E.
Vincent Dunn, FDNY (ret.)
W. Gene Corley, Ph.D., P.E., S.E.
W. Lee Evey
Wallace Miller
William Baker, P.E., S.E
William Grosshandler, Ph.D., ME
William McGuire, P.E.
Willie Quinlan, IW
Zdenek Bazant, Ph.D., S.E.
9/11 Commission & Staff
Thomas H. Kean, Chair
Lee H. Hamilton, Vice Chair
Richard Ben-Veniste
Fred F. Fielding
Jamie S. Gorelick
Slade Gorton
Bob Kerrey
John F. Lehman
Timothy J. Roemer
James R. Thompson
Joanne Accolla
Alexis Albion
Scott Allan
John Azzarello
Caroline Barnes
Warren Bass
Ann Bennett
Mark Bittinger
Madeleine Blot
Antwion Blount
Geoff Brown
Daniel Byman
Dianna Campagna
Sam Caspersen
Melissa Coffey
Lance Cole
Marquittia Coleman
Marco Cordero
Raj De Counsel
George Delgrosso
Gerald L. Dillingham
Thomas Dowling
Steven Dunne
Thomas Eldridge
John Farmer
Alvin Felzenberg
Gordon England
Lorry Fenner
Susan Ginsburg
T. Graham Giusti
Nicole Grandrimo
Doug Greenburg
Barbara Grewe
Elinore Hartz
Len Hawley
Christine Healey
Karen Heitkotter
Walt Hempel
Michael Hurley
Dana Hyde
Michael Jacobson
Bonnie Jenkins
Reginald Johnson
William Johnstone
Stephanie Kaplan
Miles Kara
Janice Kephart-Roberts
Hyon Kim
Christopher Kojm
Katarzyna (Kasia) Kozaczuk
Gordon Lederman
Daniel Leopold
Sarah Linden
Douglas MacEachin
Daniel Marcus
Ernest May
James Miller
Plus at least one person in each of these organizations.
CTL Engineering
D.H. Griffin Wrecking Co. Inc.
DeSimone Consulting Engineers
Dewhurst MacFarlane &Partners
DiSalvo Ericson Engineering
District of Columbia Fire & Rescue
DOD Honor Guard, Pentagon
D'Onofrio Construction
E-4B National Airborne Operations Center crews
Edwards and Kelcey Engineering
Engineering Systems, Inc.
Environmental protection Agency
Exponent Failure Analysis Associates
EYP Mission CriticalFacilities
Fairfax County Fire & Rescue
Falcon 20 crew in PA
Family members who received calls from victims on the planes
FBI Evidence Recovery Teams
Federal Aviation Administration
Federal Bureau of Investigation
Federal Emergency Management Agency
Federal Insurance Co.
FEMA 68-Person Urban Search and Rescue Teams: Arizona Task Force 1,
California Task Force 1,
California Task Force 3,
California Task Force 7,
Colorado Task Force 1,
Fairfax Task Force 1,
Florida Task Force 1,
Florida Task Force 2,
Maryland Task Force 1,
Massachusetts Task Force 1,
Metro Dade/Miami,
Nebraska Task Force 1,
New Mexico Task Force 1,
New York Task Force 1,
Pennsylvania Task Force 1,
Tennessee Task Force 1,
Texas Task Force 1,
Utah Task Force 1,
Virginia Task Force 1,
Virginia Task Force 2,
Washington Task Force 1
FEMA Disaster Field Office
FEMA Emergency Response Team
FEMA Urban Search and Rescue Incident Support Team-Advanced 3
Fire Department of New York
Fort Myer Fire Department
French Urban Search & Rescue Task Force
Friedens Volunteer Fire Department
Gateway Demolition
Gene Code Forensics
Georgia Tech Engineering Dept.
Gilsanz Murray Steficek LLP
GMAC Financing
Goldstein Associates Consulting Engineers
Guy Nordenson Associates
HAKS Engineers
Hampton-Clarke Inc.
HHS National Medical Response Team
HLW International Engineering
Hooversville Rescue Squad.
Hooversville Volunteer Fire Department
Hoy Structural Services
Hughes Associates, Inc
Hugo Neu Schnitzer East
hundreds of ironworkers, some of whom built the WTC
Hundreds of New York City Police Department Detectives
Industrial Risk Insurers
Institute for Civil Infrastructure Systems
International Association of Fire Chiefs
International Union of Operating Engineers Locals 14 & 15
J.R. Harris & Company
Karl Koch Steel Consulting Inc.
KCE Structural Engineers
Koch Skanska
Koutsoubis, Alonso Associates
Laboratory Corp. of America
Lamont-Doherty Earth Observatory
Leslie E. Robertson Associates
LIRo Engineering
Listie Volunteer Fire Company
Lockwood Consulting
M.G. McLaren Engineering
Masonry Society
Mazzocchi Wrecking Inc.
Metal Management Northeast
Metropolitan Airport Authority Fire Unit
Miami-Dade Urban Search & Rescue
Military District of Washington Search & Rescue Team
Montgomery County Fire & Rescue
Mueser Rutledge Consulting Engineers
Murray Engineering
Myriad Genetic Laboratories Inc.
National Center for Biotechnology Informatics
National Commission on Terrorist Attacks Upon the United States
National Council of Structural Engineers Associations
National Disaster Medical System
National Emergency Numbering Association
National Fire Protection Association
National Guard in D.C., New York, and Pennsylvania
National Institute of Standards and Technology (NIST)
National Institutes of Health Human Genome Research Institute
National Law Enforcement and Security Institute
National Military Command Center
National Reconnaissance Office
National Response Center
National Science Foundation Division of Civil and Mechanical Systems
National Security Agency
National Transportation Safety Board
National Wrecking
Natural Hazards Research and Applications Information Center
New Jersey State Police
New York City Department of Buildings WTC Task Force
New York City Department of Design and Construction
New York City Department of Environmental Protection
New York City Office of Emergency Management
New York City Office of the Chief Medical Examiner
New York City Police Department Aviation Unit
New York City Police Department Emergency Services Unit
New York Daily News
New York Flight Control Center
New York Newsday
New York Port Authority Construction Board
New York Port Authority Police
New York State Emergency Management Office
New York State Police Forensic Services
New York Times
North American Aerospace Defense Command
Northeast Air Defense Sector Commanders and crew
Numerous bomb-sniffing dogs
Numerous Forensic Anthropologists
Numerous Forensic Dentists
Numerous Forensic Pathologists
Numerous Forensic Radiologists
NuStats
Occupational Safety and Health Administration
Office of Emergency Preparedness
Office of Strategic Services
Orchid Cellmark
Parsons Brinckerhoff Engineering
Pennsylvania Department of Environmental Protection
Pennsylvania Department of Health and Human Services
Pennsylvania Region 13 Metropolitan Medical Response Group
Pennsylvania State Funeral Directors Association
Pennsylvania State Police
Pentagon Defense Protective Service
Pentagon Helicopter Crash Response Team
Pentagon Medical Staff
Pentagon Renovation Team
Phillips & Jordan, Inc.
Port of New York and New Jersey Authority
Pro-Safety Services
Protec
Public Entity Risk Institute
Purdue University Engineering Dept.
Robert Silman Associates Structural Engineers
Rolf Jensen & Associates, Inc
Rosenwasser/Grossman Consulting Engineers
Royal SunAlliance/Royal Indemnity
SACE Prime Power Assessment Teams
SACE Structural Safety Engineers and Debris Planning and Response Teams
Salvation Army Disaster Services
several EPA Hazmat Teams
several FBI Hazmat Teams
several Federal Disaster Medical Assistance Teams
several Federal Disaster Mortuary (DMORT) Teams
Severud Associates Consulting Engineers
Shanksville Volunteer Fire Company
Silverstein Properties
Simpson Gumpertz & Heger Engineers
Skidmore, Owings & Merrill LLP
Skilling Ward Magnusson Barkshire
Society of Fire Protection Engineers
Somerset Ambulance Association
Somerset County Coroner's Office
Somerset County Emergency Management Agency
Somerset Volunteer Fire Department
St. Paul/Travelers Insurance
State of Pennsylvania Emergency Management Agency
Stoystown Volunteer Fire Company
Structural Engineering Institute of the American Society of Civil Engineers (SEI/ASCE)
Structural Engineers Association of New York
Superstructures Engineering
Swiss Re America Insurance
Telephone operators who took calls from passengers in the hijacked planes
Teng & Associates
Thornton-Tomasetti Group, Inc.
TIG Insurance
Tokio Marine & Fire
Transportation Safety Administration
Tully Construction
Twin City Fire Insurance
Tylk Gustafson Reckers Wilson Andrews Engineering
U.S. Army Corps of Engineers
Underwriters Laboratories
Union Wrecking
United Airlines
United States Air National Guard
United States Fire Administration
United States Secret Service
United Steelworkers of America
University of Sheffield Fire Engineering Research
US Army Reserves of Virginia Beach Fairfax County and Montgomery County
US Army.s Communications-Electronics Command
US Department of Defense
US Department of Justice
US Department of State
Virginia Beach Fire Department
Virginia Department of Emergency Management
Virginia State Police
Vollmer Associates Engineers
Washington Post
Weeks Marine
Weidlinger Associates
Weiskopf & Pickworth Engineering
Westmoreland County Emergency Management Agency
Whitney Contracting
Willis Group Holdings
WJE Structural Engineers
Worcester Polytechnic Institute
World Trade Center security staff
XL Insurance
Yonkers Contracting
York International
Zurich Financial
Zurich Re Risk Engineering
Conspiracists: are these people liars, dupes, or shills?
--
Al Dykes
News is something someone wants to suppress, everything else is advertising.
- Lord Northcliffe, publisher of the Daily Mail

[John C. Randolph]

Post by Midex

Post by RichL
This was posted about six months ago and thoroughly discredited then.
Repeating a lie over and over again doesn't make it true.

lol. "totally discredited then".
www.ae911truth.org

Those are not experts, they are conspriacy whackos.

-jcr

[Al Dykes]

Post by Midex

Post by RichL
This was posted about six months ago and thoroughly discredited then.
Repeating a lie over and over again doesn't make it true.

lol. "totally discredited then".
www.ae911truth.org
The jury is in. It was a controlled demolition.

All those zionist hush-a-booms.

[a***@yahoo.com]

Post by s***@gmail.com
WTC Towers: The Case For Controlled Demolition
By Herman Schoenfeld
In this article we show that "top-down" controlled demolition
accurately accounts for the collapse times of the World Trade Center
towers. A top-down controlled demolition can be simply characterized
as a "pancake collapse" of a building missing its support columns.
This demolition profile requires that the support columns holding a
floor be destroyed just before that floor is collided with by the
upper falling masses. The net effect is a pancake-style collapse at
near free fall speed.

U = A Nutcase

Conspiracy theories about 9/11 implosions are impossibly assinine.
Consider:

1. Do these 9/11 IDIOTS have any idea how much EXPLOSIVES would have
been necessary to do this?

1a. WHO put these explosives in place?

1b. How come nobody SAW any of these explosives? They would have had
to have been plastered to the walls, etc. Holes would have had to have
been drilled, there would be detonator wires all over the place,
drywall would be smashed in.

1c. How come nobody SAW a team of workers bringing in TONS of
explosives into BOTH of the Twin Towers?

1d. Where would Bush have gotten such total traitors and murderers as
workers? This would certainly be repugnant to patriotic Americans of
the right wing.

1e. Why have there been no stool-pigeons? Virtually every one of
Bush's former cabinet members have turned into stool-pigeons informing
on Bush. Don't you think that some of these conspirators would have
stool-pigeoned by now?

2. WHY would Bush have even WANTED to do 9/11? It was certainly not
clear in advance that 9/11 would work to his political advantage. It
was actually a terrible stain upon his administration that 9/11
happened UNDER HIS WATCH. If the Democrats had any brains, they could
have CRUCIFIED him for it. 9/11 only "turned out" to be to Bush's
advantage. Consequently, there would not even be a motivation for it
to happen.

3. Finally, the amateur Saudi Arabian Al Quida pilots would have been
required to hit the buildings in PRECISELY the correct location to set
off all of these explosives.

4. There would have been chemical traces of explosives. Considering
that a huge amount of explosives would have been necessary, there
would have been chemical traces of them.

5. People would have seen explosives going off, if the building had
been imploded. There were no explosives. The top floors simply
collapsed of their own weight after steel supports had melted. That is
what caused the so-called "implosion". There were no explosions after
the initial impact of the airplanes.

There is ample documentation of the collapse of both buildings, and it
is clear that there were none of the explosions that you would have
seen if it had somehow been exploded.

To conclude, these are just a FEW of the arguments against the idiotic
9/11 conspiracy theories.

It is rather clear that certain people are just so desperate to deny
the REALITY of the need for the War on Terror, that they must makes up
fantasies to defy reality. The 9/11 conspiracy theories are as idiotic
as saying that Pearl Harbor never happened, or that the Holocaust
never happened.

[g.jeremija]

Post by a***@yahoo.com

Post by s***@gmail.com
WTC Towers: The Case For Controlled Demolition
By Herman Schoenfeld
In this article we show that "top-down" controlled demolition
accurately accounts for the collapse times of the World Trade Center
towers. A top-down controlled demolition can be simply characterized
as a "pancake collapse" of a building missing its support columns.
This demolition profile requires that the support columns holding a
floor be destroyed just before that floor is collided with by the
upper falling masses. The net effect is a pancake-style collapse at
near free fall speed.

U = A Nutcase
Conspiracy theories about 9/11 implosions are impossibly assinine.
1. Do these 9/11 IDIOTS have any idea how much EXPLOSIVES would have
been necessary to do this?
1a. WHO put these explosives in place?
1b. How come nobody SAW any of these explosives? They would have had
to have been plastered to the walls, etc. Holes would have had to have
been drilled, there would be detonator wires all over the place,
drywall would be smashed in.
1c. How come nobody SAW a team of workers bringing in TONS of
explosives into BOTH of the Twin Towers?
1d. Where would Bush have gotten such total traitors and murderers as
workers? This would certainly be repugnant to patriotic Americans of
the right wing.
1e. Why have there been no stool-pigeons? Virtually every one of
Bush's former cabinet members have turned into stool-pigeons informing
on Bush. Don't you think that some of these conspirators would have
stool-pigeoned by now?
2. WHY would Bush have even WANTED to do 9/11? It was certainly not
clear in advance that 9/11 would work to his political advantage. It
was actually a terrible stain upon his administration that 9/11
happened UNDER HIS WATCH. If the Democrats had any brains, they could
have CRUCIFIED him for it. 9/11 only "turned out" to be to Bush's
advantage. Consequently, there would not even be a motivation for it
to happen.
3. Finally, the amateur Saudi Arabian Al Quida pilots would have been
required to hit the buildings in PRECISELY the correct location to set
off all of these explosives.
4. There would have been chemical traces of explosives. Considering
that a huge amount of explosives would have been necessary, there
would have been chemical traces of them.
5. People would have seen explosives going off, if the building had
been imploded. There were no explosives. The top floors simply
collapsed of their own weight after steel supports had melted. That is
what caused the so-called "implosion". There were no explosions after
the initial impact of the airplanes.
There is ample documentation of the collapse of both buildings, and it
is clear that there were none of the explosions that you would have
seen if it had somehow been exploded.
To conclude, these are just a FEW of the arguments against the idiotic
9/11 conspiracy theories.
It is rather clear that certain people are just so desperate to deny
the REALITY of the need for the War on Terror, that they must makes up
fantasies to defy reality. The 9/11 conspiracy theories are as idiotic
as saying that Pearl Harbor never happened, or that the Holocaust
never happened.

[Lewis]

Post by a***@yahoo.com
1b. How come nobody SAW any of these explosives? They would have had
to have been plastered to the walls, etc. Holes would have had to have
been drilled, there would be detonator wires all over the place,
drywall would be smashed in.
1c. How come nobody SAW a team of workers bringing in TONS of
explosives into BOTH of the Twin Towers?

These are excellent points that make the whole conspiracy thing seem
rather silly.

Post by a***@yahoo.com
1d. Where would Bush have gotten such total traitors and murderers as
workers? This would certainly be repugnant to patriotic Americans of
the right wing.

Well, any GOP meeting? There are plenty of right-wingers who think any
war on brown people is a good thing, and helping out our defense
contractors is certainly worth killing some stock brokers.

But seriously, this would have taken hundreds, if not thousands of
people. No way to not have leaks.

Post by a***@yahoo.com
2. WHY would Bush have even WANTED to do 9/11?

Oh, I think the administration 'knew' something was going to happen.
That's the conspiracy I believe: they knew something was planned and
they worked to help ensure its success. They didn't know WHAT was
planned, exactly, but they certainly knew something was. And as for why,
Georgie wanted a war, simple as that. He wanted revenge on Saddam.

Post by a***@yahoo.com
4. There would have been chemical traces of explosives. Considering
that a huge amount of explosives would have been necessary, there
would have been chemical traces of them.

All the evidence was immediately and systematically destroyed. NONE of
the wreckage was examined, ever. It could have been covered with C4
residue and no one would ever have known.

Post by a***@yahoo.com
To conclude, these are just a FEW of the arguments against the idiotic
9/11 conspiracy theories.

We've come to expect the worse of the government. They've killed over
4,000 soldiers in a senseless, stupid, and illegal war. Why not kill a
few thousands civilians to start it?

I don't believe any of the 9/11 conspiracy crap. It makes the Kennedy
assassination theories look down right factual by comparison (and I
don't believe that either). But I can certainly understand why people
think there was a conspiracy: it's the kind of thing they expect from
the jack-booted thugs in the White House.

Post by a***@yahoo.com
It is rather clear that certain people are just so desperate to deny
the REALITY of the need for the War on Terror,

There is 1) no need for it because you can't have a war on something
that has no organized presence and 2) the war on Iraq has NOTHING to do
with terrorists. Never has.

The Pentagon's own report shows that there were NO links between Saddam
and Al Queda. NONE.

[Octopus Ride]

Paranoia sucks. yadda yadda yadda

[g.jeremija]

Post by a***@yahoo.com
U = A Nutcase
Conspiracy theories about 9/11 implosions are impossibly assinine.
1. Do these 9/11 IDIOTS have any idea how much EXPLOSIVES would have
been necessary to do this?

tell us.. how much?

Post by a***@yahoo.com
1a. WHO put these explosives in place?

people who are payed money...

Post by a***@yahoo.com
1b. How come nobody SAW any of these explosives? They would have had
to have been plastered to the walls, etc. Holes would have had to have
been drilled, there would be detonator wires all over the place,
drywall would be smashed in.

the explosives are put on the core/supporting columns of the building,
not walls... my guess is that those columns are not visible from the
inside of the building...

Post by a***@yahoo.com
1c. How come nobody SAW a team of workers bringing in TONS of
explosives into BOTH of the Twin Towers?

here we return at the number 1 question.. dO YOU KNOW for a fact how
much explosives is needed? i really don't...

Post by a***@yahoo.com
1d. Where would Bush have gotten such total traitors and murderers as
workers? This would certainly be repugnant to patriotic Americans of
the right wing.

dunno, don't care... everyone has his price... and why would they be
americans at all?

Post by a***@yahoo.com
1e. Why have there been no stool-pigeons? Virtually every one of
Bush's former cabinet members have turned into stool-pigeons informing
on Bush. Don't you think that some of these conspirators would have
stool-pigeoned by now?

coz it would mean for them (these stool-pigeons you talk of) to addmit
that they are traitors...

Post by a***@yahoo.com
2. WHY would Bush have even WANTED to do 9/11? It was certainly not
clear in advance that 9/11 would work to his political advantage. It
was actually a terrible stain upon his administration that 9/11
happened UNDER HIS WATCH. If the Democrats had any brains, they could
have CRUCIFIED him for it. 9/11 only "turned out" to be to Bush's
advantage. Consequently, there would not even be a motivation for it
to happen.

newsflash: bush is an idiot and a clown.. do you think an idiot and a
clown could plot such a massive fraud on us citizens? i don't..
bush is an expendable product.. he survived.. good for him...

Post by a***@yahoo.com
3. Finally, the amateur Saudi Arabian Al Quida pilots would have been
required to hit the buildings in PRECISELY the correct location to set
off all of these explosives.

theres a thing called remote control here in the future...

Post by a***@yahoo.com
4. There would have been chemical traces of explosives. Considering
that a huge amount of explosives would have been necessary, there
would have been chemical traces of them.

Loading Image...
melted steel looks pretty decent to me...
jet fuel (kerosene) burns on a maximum burning temperature of near
1000°C (1800°F)...
the melting point of steel is at 1400°C-1500°C (around 2600°F).. do you
see the difference here?

Post by a***@yahoo.com
5. People would have seen explosives going off, if the building had
been imploded. There were no explosives. The top floors simply
collapsed of their own weight after steel supports had melted. That is
what caused the so-called "implosion". There were no explosions after
the initial impact of the airplanes.

there are numerous reports from massive amount of people of explosions
going off.. on the same day, not days later.. the same day.. people are
covered in dust, bleeding and everyone is talking about explosions...
even the live news reporters from numerous reporting houses are talking
about the explosions while the dust hasn't even settled down...
and why wouldn't it be? there would be smaller explosions going
throughout the buildings wheter someone planted explosives or not...

Post by a***@yahoo.com
There is ample documentation of the collapse of both buildings, and it
is clear that there were none of the explosions that you would have
seen if it had somehow been exploded.

can you show us this documentation? dows this documentation cover the
fall of building 7?

Post by a***@yahoo.com
To conclude, these are just a FEW of the arguments against the idiotic
9/11 conspiracy theories.

these are not at all good arguments.. i'm not a conspiracy freak, hell
i'm not even from US... nothing would make me happier to know that one
of the biggest acts of treason in human history actually never
happend.. that PEOPLE IN A CAVE made NORAD stand down... theres just
too many points to this day that prove that something wrong was did
that day...

Post by a***@yahoo.com
It is rather clear that certain people are just so desperate to deny
the REALITY of the need for the War on Terror, that they must makes up
fantasies to defy reality. The 9/11 conspiracy theories are as idiotic
as saying that Pearl Harbor never happened, or that the Holocaust
never happened.

you watch too much tv... i advise against it...

[Midex]

Post by a***@yahoo.com

Post by s***@gmail.com
WTC Towers: The Case For Controlled Demolition
By Herman Schoenfeld
In this article we show that "top-down" controlled demolition
accurately accounts for the collapse times of the World Trade Center
towers. A top-down controlled demolition can be simply characterized
as a "pancake collapse" of a building missing its support columns.
This demolition profile requires that the support columns holding a
floor be destroyed just before that floor is collided with by the
upper falling masses. The net effect is a pancake-style collapse at
near free fall speed.

U = A Nutcase
Conspiracy theories about 9/11 implosions are impossibly assinine.
1. Do these 9/11 IDIOTS have any idea how much EXPLOSIVES would have
been necessary to do this?

"1. Do these 9/11 IDIOTS have any idea how much EXPLOSIVES would have
been necessary to do this?"

Well according to you it wouldn't be much at all would it. According
to you the buildings behaved the way they did without ANY explosives.

So there we witness the botomless falsehood of your position against
the controlled demolition conclusion.

On one had you defend the position that the buildings behaved the way
they did without explosives from fire alone. On the other hand you
imply that a massive volume of explosives would be needed to get the
three towers to do what they did.

lol. You're a fuckwit or A JEW. Take your choice.

<rest of your bullshit snipped accordingly>